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As far as future matches go, I want to see Gohan vs 17 just to get a gist of how big the gap is between them. I know 17 would spam his barrier, but Gohan's ability to deal with that would help decipher the gap. And of course, UI Goku vs Beerus, all-out. But I can wait because I know Goku is...

Hit was going all-out against Jiren, though. Wouldn't Krillin be able to gauge based off that?

Ooh, I like that. Takes statements and feats into consideration, doesn't really make bold assumptions. Feels goooood.

I want to see what goes on in the other universes. I'm tired of Goku and Vegeta with the usual "bad guy arrives, current power/transformation isn't enough, train, get new shit, beat bad guy by some luck" routine. What goes on without the U7 Saiyans clogging the spotlight?

Huh? Rumsshi dodged both cards flung at him and took no damage. It doesn't seem like anyone took damage from Belmod's attack, unlike Rumsshi's battle roar that had everyone frazzled enough to bulldoze through them. I was actually mistakenly thinking of the robot suit god, Mosco. Right before...

She joked about it being obvious based on Champa being a tub of lard, but I don't think it's that cut and dry. Could be a bigger gap than I originally perceived, though.

Beerus has been a destroyer for millions of years while Belmod is relatively new to the job as far as I recall. Champa is implied to be slightly weaker than Beerus due to slacking on his training by Vados. That gap should carry into the god battle royale. Rumsshi is one of the four gods...

The Belmod wank is real. He literally did almost nothing in the fight before playing possum. His special move did no damage to the other gods so what is everyone riding his dick for? According to the story, he's one of the weaker gods. He's inferior to Jiren, who got punked by UI Goku, who's now...

How is this so far? It's only to the point where Vegeta goes to Yardrat and Goku starts training with Merus. Small units for the numbers. Goku ~Base: 1 ~Super Saiyan: 2 ~Super Saiyan 3: 8 ~Super Saiyan God: 32 ~Complete Super Saiyan Blue: 320 Vegeta ~Base: 1 ~Super Saiyan: 2 ~Super Saiyan 2...

They have god ki in them so they should be able to always sense it.

Impossibly correct because I'm following the story. If you can't grasp that, maybe your hand is too full of man ass.

So accept the statement as it is and chew some gum, unless you've got evidence to prove Whis wrong right now.

Wow, you eat ass for ignoring a blatant statement like that. Hyuk hyuk. @Super Saiyan Goku stated Vegeta wasn't losing any power through the switch technique.

I agree with you, meng, and imma let you finish. But didn't Dende say 17 wasn't the same as before? So he had to have been watching at some point.

After he tooled SSJG Goku/Vegeta initially, I believe.

I still don't agree about that one "he's almost as strong as us" line meaning 17's literally almost as strong as Goku and Vegeta. Like you said, his feats don't back it up, and the line is ambiguous enough that it can be more broad than specific.

For sure. The first two seasons are basically episodic villains and wacky adventures, but the third and fourth seasons get pretty dark with people being killed left and right toward the end. I've heard the manga is drastically different from the anime but I've never read that one.

Same. I liked the monster-of-the-week format better than a season-long villain. Stuff just got too serious and meh. I wanted to know more about Duel Academy and shit, not whatever was copied from the original Duel Monsters seasons.

I misread it. Nevermind. Regarding Goku and Vegeta, it's stated in chapter 70. Goku: "Do you know of someone stronger than us, Whis?" Whis: "No, not specifically." So Broly ain't it, boss.

The usage of toughest is still most likely referring to strength, though. It's only ever been used to describe durability and strength, so take your pick, snob. Nah, man. That still means ToP Goku > Moro arc Goku, which is turds.