Beerus vs Hit, Cabba and Frost

[Spiral-Force]

@xmysticgohanx

Episode: 54
Time: 8:37
Context: Beerus talking about Zamasu.
Beerus: "He may be a god, but he's still just an apprentice Kaioshin. He wouldn't stand a chance against Goku, someone who's fought against me."

This is a clear-cut SSJG Goku (BoG Saga) >>> Zamasu indication.

Regarding your quotes, it's highly likely that SSJ Goku's "Godku-level" power diminished or was retconned. This is reinforced by the quote above, and by Goku saying that Zamasu might become as strong as Beerus one day (keep in mind that the only Beerus that Goku can base this judgement on is Beerus [vs SSJG Goku]).

 

[ahill1]

This is reinforced by the quote above, and by Goku saying that Zamasu might become as strong as Beerus one day (keep in mind that the only Beerus that Goku can base this judgement on is Beerus [vs SSJG Goku]).

Goku somehow knows Beerus is way stronger than that though, as he prepared the Kaioken x10 on top of the SSJ Blue to fight him. Not only this, but Goku witnessed how Monaka "easily defeated" Hit and yet he thinks Monaka is probably below Beerus.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

But Monaka is really strong!

 

[Spiral-Force]

Goku somehow knows Beerus is way stronger than that though, as he prepared the Kaioken x10 on top of the SSJ Blue to fight him. Not only this, but Goku witnessed how Monaka "easily defeated" Hit and yet he thinks Monaka is probably below Beerus.

Goku didn't specify on the level of Kaio-ken that he wanted to use against Beerus. Hell, even if he was referring to Kkx10, he certainly wouldn't want Beerus rivalling that power, because in that case, stamina issues would likely lead to Goku losing. As for the Monaka point, I know that Champa/Beerus >>> SSJB Kaio-ken x10 Goku is heavily implied, but Beerus' full power is still unknown, so it would be far-fetched for Goku to be basing his Zamasu statement on FP Beerus.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

Well, Hit shit his pants when Champa was about to destroy them so that tells us how strong Beerus and Champa are.

 

[Spiral-Force]

Well, Hit shit his pants when Champa was about to destroy them so that tells us how strong Beerus and Champa are.

Indeed, but why would Goku state that Zamasu might become as strong as a Beerus who's true full power is unknown? Considering: SSJG Goku (BoG Saga) >>> Zamasu, it would make sense for Goku to have Beerus (vs Goku) in mind.

 

[Tapion]

Well, both Goku and Hit told Champa to shut the fuck up by glaring at him, so i think that implies a team-up of SSJB Goku(Kaioken x10) and Hit can take on Champa

 

[Spiral-Force]

Well, both Goku and Hit told Champa to shut the fuck up by glaring at him, so i think that implies a team-up of SSJB Goku(Kaioken x10) and Hit can take on Champa

I think the animators just wanted to showcase Champa being surprised that the pawns were showing resistance, in an amusing way. Champa was confident in sweeping the entire Universe 6 team & Goku, and Vados (who usually warns Champa about doing stupid things) didn't question Champa's actions.

 

[ahill1]

Goku didn't specify on the level of Kaio-ken that he wanted to use against Beerus. Hell, even if he was referring to Kkx10, he certainly wouldn't want Beerus rivalling that power, because in that case, stamina issues would likely lead to Goku losing. As for the Monaka point, I know that Champa/Beerus >>> SSJB Kaio-ken x10 Goku is heavily implied, but Beerus' full power is still unknown, so it would be far-fetched for Goku to be basing his Zamasu statement on FP Beerus.

Goku also saw Monaka defeating Hit in one hit, and as far as he knows, Monaka is really that strong. Even so, Beerus stated Monaka is the strongest person he ever fought and nothing implies the God cat was defeated or something, so as far as Goku knows Beerus > power needed to easily defeat Hit (Monaka). Hit could be a bit tired at that moment, but not anything worthy that much imo.

Even if Goku doesn't know exactly how powerful Beerus is, he still knows he is far, far stronger than when he fought him, so I don't think it's far-fetched to think Goku was basing off Beerus' power on something far above what he displayed earlier. Even if he doesn't know exactly his power, he still thinks Beerus is far above Hit and probably his 10 fold Kaioken.

 

[ahill1]

Champa was confident in sweeping the entire Universe 6 team & Goku,

Wasn't Goku tired at that moment?

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

Champa was confident in sweeping the entire Universe 6 team & Goku,

Wasn't Goku tired at that moment?

Not only he was tired, SuperGoku's body was fucked up.

 

[Spiral-Force]

Goku also saw Monaka defeating Hit in one hit, and as far as he knows, Monaka is really that strong. Even so, Beerus stated Monaka is the strongest person he ever fought and nothing implies the God cat was defeated or something, so as far as Goku knows Beerus > power needed to easily defeat Hit (Monaka). Hit could be a bit tired at that moment, but not anything worthy that much imo.

Even if Goku doesn't know exactly how powerful Beerus is, he still knows he is far, far stronger than when he fought him, so I don't think it's far-fetched to think Goku was basing off Beerus' power on something far above what he displayed earlier. Even if he doesn't know exactly his power, he still thinks Beerus is far above Hit and probably his 10 fold Kaioken.

I watched the episode again. Goku stating that Zamasu might become as strong as Beerus doesn't contradict anything, because he didn't give a time span. So Zamasu can be greatly inferior to SSJG Goku, but get to Beerus' level (Goku's estimations) one day.

Wasn't Goku tired at that moment?

Somewhat. Still, Champa's substantial superiority over them was well-established.

Champa: "Time-Leap, Super Saiyan... Use whatever tricks you like!"

 

[ahill1]

The fact is, Goku doesn't know how strong Beerus truly is, so either Goku was exaggerating, or he was basing his judgement on one of Beerus' suppressed states. Currently, I think Goku was merely exaggerating, but if we were to take his statement somewhat seriously, then Beerus (vs Goku) would likely be who Goku had in mind.

Does Goku know Beerus > Kaioken x10 Blue Goku?

Somewhat. Still, Champa's substantial superiority over them was well-established.

Yeah, Goku knows Champa/Beerus > Goku and Hit.

 

[Spiral-Force]

@ahill Reply to my edited post.

 

[ahill1]

I watched the episode again. Goku stating that Zamasu might surpass Beerus doesn't contradict anything, because he didn't give a time span. So Zamasu can be greatly inferior to SSJG Goku, and could surpass Beerus (Goku's estimations) one day.

You changed your response, huh? I never said it contradicts anything, that's not my point. Just saying I don't think Goku was thinking only of the power Beerus was using against him.

 

[Spiral-Force]

You changed your response, huh? I never said it contradicts anything, that's not my point. Just saying I don't think Goku was thinking only of the power Beerus was using against him.

I'm not saying you said there was a contradiction.

Basically, I originally thought that Goku said that Zamasu might become as strong as Beerus soon, but he actually didn't give a time span. Now that I am aware of that, it doesn't really matter what Beerus Goku had in mind.

Zamasu (in the future, possibly) = Beerus (Goku's estimations) >>> SSJG Goku (BoG Saga) >>> Zamasu (when he met Goku)

Do you get it now?

 

[ahill1]

I'm not saying you said there was a contradiction.

Basically, I originally thought that Goku said that Zamasu might surpass Beerus soon, but he actually didn't give a time span. Now that I am aware of that, it doesn't really matter what Beerus Goku had in mind.

Zamasu (in the future, possibly) > Beerus (Goku's estimations) >>> SSJG Goku (BoG Saga) >>> Zamasu (when he met Goku)

You mean "one day", right?

 

[Spiral-Force]

You mean "one day", right?

Yeah. I didn't include the "soon" part in my earlier posts, but that's definitely what I had in mind at the time. At least we're on the same page now.

 

[ahill1]

Yeah. I didn't include the "soon" part in my earlier posts, but that's definitely what I had in mind at the time. At least we're on the same page now.

Wait, you were thinking Goku said that Zamasu might surpass Beerus one day, but as he didn't specify the time, he could mean soon?

 

[Spiral-Force]

Wait, you were thinking Goku said that Zamasu might surpass Beerus one day, but as he didn't specify the time, he could mean soon?

No, I thought he said something along the lines of "one day soon".