Cell Games

[ahill1]

What's your analysis on the Cell Games as a whole? Did you enjoy it? Do you think it was well handled?

Imo, it was one of the strong suits of the story. It had an important moment of Goku, this time admitting he isn't strong enough to protect the Earth and passing the torch to his son, the strongest there besides Cell. I also enjoyed how everyone who doubted Goku's words on Gohan's power were left flabbergasted once this latter showed that what Goku was saying wasn't merely madness, once he powered to full power.

The KMHMH clash wasn't so dragged out as in the anime, but I enjoyed how fast paced it was in the manga. Vegeta was also one of the strong suits in the arc... I enjoyed how he showed there one of his first signs of humanity and proved that what Future Bulma said about him wasn't inaccurate. Nice to see how he for the first time said sorry to someone, recognising he only screwed up the situation. Moments like this from Vegeta are always good to see. Nice to see how he also aided in the end of the beam clash, handing an opening for Gohan to finish Cell once and for all.

Piccolo seems to have also recognised and appreciated Vegeta's effort, as he offered to lend this latter a hand when he was seemingly powerless and had barely energy enough to fly home, much to Vegeta's rejection. Vegeta, even though he showed strong sides of humanity, still showed himself to be a proud warrior and don't seem to copy too well with the idea of having been completely surprised.

All in all, I found it a good portion of the story, featuring good and unique moments, good battles that were handled in a nice pace.

 

[GreatSaiyaman123]

It was the best part of the Cell Arc, since Toriyama had finally decided who the main villian is and who would defeat him. Still, Gohan taking the spotlight without much foreshadowing if at all was sort of disappointing.

Vegeta snapping after Trunks dies and him apologising to Gohan were great scenes, just like the beam struggle. They do lose their weight when you remember that everything regarding Cell's comeback is forced and a plothole.

Fun to read, but i give it a 5/10.

 

[sei'taer]

Cell vs Goku was great.

Gohan vs cell was meh

kamehameha duel was great

Cell regenerating was bunk

 

[Pocket-Gog~]

I'd say the Cell Games is weakened by Gohan's forced pacifism for the sake of drama, and him suddenly being forced into the role of main character despite not doing anything for the entire story.

 

[Void]

Cell vs. Goku was decent. The rest was pretty meh, honestly. Even the Kamehameha duel was anti climactic in the manga, and too dragged out in the anime.

 

[ahill1]

I'd say the Cell Games is weakened by Gohan's forced pacifism for the sake of drama, and him suddenly being forced into the role of main character despite not doing anything for the entire story.

That's a good point. I agree that Gohan seemed to have his personality changing somewhat for the sake of building drama.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

The arc was too dragged but that's always been the case on each final arcs anyway. Still the funidub did a great job with their soundtracks during that final KHH struggle and always makes me watched it again. Goku Vs Cell was great, but SS2 Gohan Vs Cell should've been shorter though.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

It was terrible, like most of the Cell Arc. Goku VS Cell had good choreography, but meant nothing overall in retrospect when knowing Cell could've ended it with one hit if he felt like, making it yet another Goku VS Freeza situation. It was also poor how the battle had little emotional weight behind it when unlike previous villains, Cell had yet to kill any of the main cast's allies. Furthermore, the handling of Gohan's character is what really brings the arc down. He suddenly became pacifistic towards fighting someone like Cell, despite the fact even without being enraged he seemingly killed one of Freeza's soldiers on Namek back when he was far less used to battle, making the entire Gohan VS Cell fight prior to the SS2 transformation completely contrived and boring. It also doesn't help that the transformation was brought about by a minor character who the audience had no reason to be invested in. After that, Gohan goes through yet another character rewrite in becoming overly arrogant and Cell is reduced to just being a Saiyan Arc Vegeta/Freeza clone.

Only things I found good were it introducing Mr. Satan, who would become one of the more well handled characters in the series during the next arc, and the anime version of Gohan's SS2 transformation being good in a superficial sense with one of the best insert songs in the franchise. Vegeta's act of fighting for Trunks' sake could have also been good had his character not gone through a major regression throughout the entirety of the arc up to that point and his care for Trunks having came out of nowhere.

 

[ahill1]

I don't think Vegeta's care for Trunks came out of nowhere. They still spent a year in the RoSaT together, which is plenty of time for Vegeta to develop some kind of affection towards Trunks, which he clearly hadn't pre RoSaT, as wee see he not even bothering to protect present Trunks for Gero's blasts.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

I don't think Vegeta's care for Trunks came out of nowhere. They still spent a year in the RoSaT together, which is plenty of time for Vegeta to develop some kind of affection towards Trunks, which he clearly hadn't pre RoSaT, as wee see he not even bothering to protect present Trunks for Gero's blasts.

We never saw their training or any change in their interaction after being in the Rosat, so it means nothing. Them going in alone for their 2nd trip could even be seen as outright disproving any growth in their relationship.

 

[ahill1]

I don't think Vegeta's care for Trunks came out of nowhere. They still spent a year in the RoSaT together, which is plenty of time for Vegeta to develop some kind of affection towards Trunks, which he clearly hadn't pre RoSaT, as wee see he not even bothering to protect present Trunks for Gero's blasts.

We never saw their training or any change in their interaction after being in the Rosat, so it means nothing. Them going in alone for their 2nd trip could even be seen as outright disproving any growth in their relationship.

Vegeta opting to go alone doesn't mean he won't care for Trunks were this latter to get killed. It just means he'd rather spend such time alone if he has the option. It's true that we never saw their training, but it still isn't "out of nowhere" when we know he still spent a year with his son there, which is plenty of time for an affection towards his son to be developed. It'd come outta nowhere if we knew they didn't spend time together or if there was nothing that could justify Vegeta's feelings development.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

It still doesn't change that Vegeta's interactions with Trunks after the Rosat were no different to before it, thus, still making it a sloppy attempt at character development.
Also, he had full knowledge that Trunks could still be revived with the Dragon Balls and is usually pretty level headed when it comes to thinking how to use them (eg. proposing the idea to wish Goku and Kuririn's souls to Earth to avoid them dying in space after Namek's Explosion), so his decision was still inconsistent with what he'd shown up to that point.

 

[ahill1]

It still doesn't change that Vegeta's interactions with Trunks after the Rosat were no different to before it, thus, still making it a sloppy attempt at character development.
Also, he had full knowledge that Trunks could still be revived with the Dragon Balls and is usually pretty level headed when it comes to thinking how to use them (eg. proposing the idea to wish Goku and Kuririn's souls to Earth to avoid them dying in space after Namek's Explosion), so his decision was still inconsistent with what he'd shown up to that point.

They were shown to be different when Vegeta ignored reason and attacked Cell after Trunks had been blasted in the chest. You're arguing that Vegeta's care for Trunks came out of nowhere when that's not the case as, even if Vegeta was shown not to behave that differently post his RoSaT turn, that still serves as a viable explanation for why he was angry when Trunks was killed. Also worth adding that such side from Vegeta had already been kind of foreshadowed by future Bulma when she said she knows Vegeta isn't just a cold hearted killer and that he has some humanity in him. It wasn't completely devoid of complementation.

Characters are shown not to behave in their natural way when blinded by rage/to not think clearly when influenced by anger, which was the case with Vegeta. Cell, who had scholded Trunks for using a complete irrelevant transformation that kills speed still resorted to such when he was blinded by rage upon how powerless he was against Gohan.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

Yes, it serves as an explanation, but by not having any sort of gradual development between the two onscreen, it's overall poor development. If an explanation for a character's change in demeanour is based on events that occurred entirely offscreen, then it's a highly lazy method.

 

[ahill1]

Yes, it serves as an explanation, but by not having any sort of gradual development between the two onscreen, it's overall poor development. If an explanation for a character's change in demeanour is based on events that occurred entirely offscreen, then it's a highly lazy method.

Well, I see your point.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

I see it as Vegeta feeling so weak that he couldn't even save himself against Cell let alone Trunks as well. You could also add the fact that Goku sacrificed himself to correct his son's mistake in front of Vegeta.

But of course this is just a headcanon.

 

[Victorious]

Yeah I don't get why Gohan suddenly became a Pacifist, he was never battle hungry like a pure Saiyan, sure...like Vegeta or Goku are.

But he was never "I shall not fight" type. I mean he had no problem fighting Freeza's goons, or Guldo, or Ginyu in Goku's body, or Freeza. But suddenly he won't fight? I think it was just nerves more than anything because Goku had now been beaten and everyone was now counting on him.

But yeah, the Cell Games is my favorite sequence in all of Dragon Ball. We get the awesome Goku vs Cell fight, and then the emotional Gohan moments and Gohan becoming SSJ2. It's my favorite segment in all of DB. Cell was a damn good villain too.