How do you justify the x10 multiplier?

[SSJ3 Gothic]

For anyone who accepts a x10 multiplier for SSJ, how do you make that work when x50 syncs up so well and is widely accepted? Especially when Goku could pull a Kaioken x20 with little to no effect...

 

[GreatSaiyaman123]

Only, at the time, it was considered that his strength would increase 50-fold when he became a Super Saiyan, but that was a bit of an exaggeration. My feeling as the creator is that, while drawing it, I felt that it was about a 10-fold change from what it was up to that point.

http://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/seg-story-volume-truth-about-dragon-ball/

 

[SSJ3 Gothic]

I know where it came from I am asking how people make it work.

 

[SSJ2]

Gero's calculations based on his sensors said the combined power of suppressed Piccolo (weaker than Base Vegeta), plus all the other earthlings would allow him to surpass SSJ Vegeta. If you take this claim to be true, it's easier to modify the SSJ multiplier to be 10x or less to follow this.

 

[SSJ3 Gothic]

So do you have to just disregard scouter numbers and such?

 

[GreatSaiyaman123]

Oh, regarding the Kaioken stuff?

10x was the best Goku could do without wrecking his body, though it probably still had some strain on him, like Kaioken x2 had back on Earth, so let's ignore any further level from Kaioken. Between a 10x Kaioken boost and a 10x SSJ boost, SSJ is the obvious better choice due to being less strainful. Not to mention Kaioken is only usable in bursts whereas Super Saiyan is constant.

Not to mention the two times he used Super Saiyan post Freeza's death, he never had any opportunity that he could use Kaioken:
~ Vs Androids he wasn't feeling well, so Kaioken's strain would just fuck him up badly,
~ Cell Games he not only made SSJ way more effective by mastering it completely and overcoming the strain, but the only point of his fight with Cell was to show Gohan Cell's moves, powering up further would be pointless.

 

[SSJ3 Gothic]

Not being contrarian here, just devil's advocate. Strain or no, if a x20 Kaioken barely scratched a surpressed Freeza, would a x10 boost with no strain make any difference? Did Goku get a zenkai between ×20 and SSJ using this method?

 

[Captain Cadaver]

SSJ2 covered why I use a 10x boost for the pre-Rosat Artificial Human Arc. As far as I'm concerned, SSJ multipliers and any other sort of multipliers are purely plot based, hence why Gotenks has a small enough multiplier that his Base form is above the SS2s and his SSJ not too far above SS3 Goku, whereas his fusees seem to go with a 50x boost due to the gap between MSSJ Gohan (Boo Arc) and #18.

Toriyama never thought of the plot in terms of numbers anyway, with his initial obliviousness to the flaw of initially having SSJ as 10x base proving as much.

 

[SSJ3 Gothic]

SSJ2 covered why I use a 10x boost for the pre-Rosat Artificial Human Arc. As far as I'm concerned, SSJ multipliers and any other sort of multipliers are purely plot based, hence why Gotenks has a small enough multiplier that his Base form is above the SS2s and his SSJ not too far above SS3 Goku, whereas his fusees seem to go with a 50x boost due to the gap between MSSJ Gohan (Boo Arc) and #18.

Toriyama never thought of the plot in terms of numbers anyway, with his initial obliviousness to the flaw of initially having SSJ as 10x base proving as much.

So basically it's kind of a crapshoot either way and you just gotta use whatever is comfortable?

 

[Captain Cadaver]

Basically. It's what 's been doing for years after all.

Not to mention Vegeta's statement of "We Saiyans can't be measured with mere numbers" can be seen as a meta commentary on the whole thing.

 

[withheldforprivacy]

Not being contrarian here, just devil's advocate. Strain or no, if a x20 Kaioken barely scratched a surpressed Freeza, would a x10 boost with no strain make any difference? Did Goku get a zenkai between ×20 and SSJ using this method?

You can follow Freezamite's theory about Freeza being so weakened by spirit bomb that Goku no longer needed 20x a multiplier to take him.

 

[GreatSaiyaman123]

You might as well follow the invisible Kaioken theory and have Freeza on CG level.