Is there anything that fore-shadowed Gohan becoming the hero in the Cell Saga?

[Fantastische Hure]

IIRC, Goku said before training that he wanted Gohan to surpass him.

There's also Gohan attaining SSJ. Goku defeated Freeza, Trunks one-shotted Freeza in his first appearance, Vegeta didn't do much but still got to defeat #19.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

Not really. Things such as Goku wanting Gohan to surpass him or Goku pointing out how Gohan has constantly kept up with him and the other main fighters doesn't really say much when those don't specifically mean Gohan would be the hero when he's done the exact same in the previous arcs without being the centre of attention (other than arguably the Vegeta fight where he was the one to take the win). There was still no build up to his conflict with Cell due to a complete lack of interaction between them and Cell's only act of making things personal between them (almost killing Piccolo) pales in comparison to what Nappa/Vegeta provided to Goku's personal stake in their battle(s), nevermind what Freeza did. With Cell's background and thematic relevance, it would've made more sense to the narrative to either have Goku be his main opponent or, better yet, have the catalyst of this arc that was Trunks become the hero and make him more than just the messenger of exposition. Future Trunks in many ways seemed like a more believable Future Gohan than the actual one we got with the parallels between them, both being polite half-Saiyans who can let their emotions dictate their actions on occasion (Gohan's rage bursts and Trunks attempting to do anything to stop #17, #18 and Cell respectively) and whilst both aren't as skilled as their respective father's in combat, are far more savvy in other areas and both can be seen as having their father be their weakness (Gohan getting angry when Raditz/Vegeta hurt Goku or holding back against Goku Ginyu, whilst Trunks held back Grade 3 due to not wanting to tarnish Vegeta's pride).

As for Gohan achieving SSJ, I'd say that means nothing when it had simply become the standard for any Saiyan who wanted to be plot-relevant at that point, the initial SSJ threshold of power had become fodder as soon as Cell beat Piccolo/#17 and we were made aware prior to the Cell Game his future self had attained the form too. Speaking of Future Gohan, the fact that a far older and more experienced version of Gohan with Super Saiyan was still no match for #17 further diminishes any attempted build-up for the present Gohan's eventual role.

 

[Fantastische Hure]

I think Goku saying he wants Gohan to surpass him has a different meaning in this context though. He wants him to surpass him without any rage-boosts. Surpass him as the highest in the group (which Goku usually always was up-to this point from the Z-Team side at-least other than Vegeta & Piccolo momentarily surpassing him).

I wouldn't say SSJ was that way then. That happened in the Boo saga. Goku & Gohan exited the chamber as Mastered SSJs, something Vegeta didn't even think of.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

I think Goku saying he wants Gohan to surpass him has a different meaning in this context though. He wants him to surpass him without any rage-boosts. Surpass him as the highest in the group (which Goku usually always was up-to this point from the Z-Team side at-least other than Vegeta & Piccolo momentarily surpassing him).

And then he made it apparent in the fight with Cell he wanted Gohan to unleash his latent power through rage. :elmo

I wouldn't say SSJ was that way then. That happened in the Boo saga. Goku & Gohan exited the chamber as Mastered SSJs, something Vegeta didn't even think of.

After having achieved forms beyond Super Saiyan and training to better utilise the initial form and increasing their power in general far more than what they were at before the training, the pre-Rosat selves of 3/4 of the Saiyans being irrelevant by the time they came out.

 

[Fantastische Hure]

I think Goku saying he wants Gohan to surpass him has a different meaning in this context though. He wants him to surpass him without any rage-boosts. Surpass him as the highest in the group (which Goku usually always was up-to this point from the Z-Team side at-least other than Vegeta & Piccolo momentarily surpassing him).

And then he made it apparent in the fight with Cell he wanted Gohan to unleash his latent power through rage. :elmo

I wouldn't say SSJ was that way then. That happened in the Boo saga. Goku & Gohan exited the chamber as Mastered SSJs, something Vegeta didn't even think of.

After having achieved forms beyond Super Saiyan and training to better utilise the initial form and increasing their power in general far more than what they were at before the training, the pre-Rosat selves of 3/4 of the Saiyans being irrelevant by the time they came out.

True but what I meant was that initially he also seemed to imply he wanted him to surpass him even without anger-boosts, which he did, he just didn't surpass Cell.

That's what I mean. It still means that SSJ is still something huge at this point, even if the SSJs were irrelevant pre-RoSaT, they once again took the centre-stage post-RoSaT plot-wise.

 

[SSJ2]

Piccolo said many times in the Saiyan arc that he had higher potential than anyone.

 

[Fantastische Hure]

That is very true. The beginning of the Cell saga sort-of made you almost forget that though (in the sense that that'll be a factor) because everyone was an SSJ and Piccolo was SSJ tier, yet we hadn't seen a rage-boost since when? vs 3rd form Freeza?

 

[Captain Cadaver]

Not foreshadowing of Gohan's role, but a nice tie-in I noticed. Gohan defeats Cell and saves the world whilst only able to use one arm, similar to how Goku was only able to use one arm when he first saved the world against Piccolo Daimao. This being intentional is even more likely when taking into account this arc shares some similarities to the Piccolo Daimao Arc, such as both main villains fighting against the royal army and telling the world of their goals through a television broadcast, and of course the Earth's King saying in his broadcast he hopes someone like the boy who defeated Piccolo Daimao will step up to stop Cell.

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[Fantastische Hure]

I noticed that before already. That also shows us the big difference in personality/will-power between Goku & Gohan. Gohan in the same situation gave-up and basically accepted the fate of the universe (before Goku encouraged him), where-as Goku kept fighting until he defeated Piccolo-Daimao. Gohan was more relatable than believe in the power-of-plot Goku.

 

[PorchMaster]

In fairness, Gohan was at half the ki level of Cell while Goku didn't have anywhere near that level of disadvantage, aside from his legs being broken (which didn't matter as the final blow was a punch anyway).

 

[Fantastische Hure]

Goku's ki was probably way down as-well, especially since Piccolo-Daimao thought he was going to easily win.

 

[PorchMaster]

Goku punched straight through Daimao without any assistance so his ki probably wasn't down by a lot. Not to mention Daimao's ki decreased significantly from using the Bakurikimaha twice.

 

[Fantastische Hure]

Goku punched straight through Daimao without any assistance so his ki probably wasn't down by a lot. Not to mention Daimao's ki decreased significantly from using the Bakurikimaha twice.

True, but Piccolo-Daimao still thought after that that'd be easy to win so I'd assume that Piccolo-Daimao still had decent amount of power left to defeat. Goku defeating him doesn't really have to mean his ki wasn't way down in my opinion, Gohan was also able to restore his whole power at the end of the KHH struggle to defeat Cell. Even PD was surprised.

 

[PorchMaster]

Goku had also lost 3 of his limbs by that point, which I think was a bigger reason Daimao underestimated Galu than anything else. Gohan also reverted to his base form and couldn't move after defeating Cell, so that final burst probably took more out of Gohan than Goku's final punch did. Galu could still sit up after defeating Daimao.

 

[Fantastische Hure]

Well Gohan did just perform a KHH and was in a KHH struggle compared to Goku just punching through Piccolo-Daimao. 2 2 2

 

[PorchMaster]

Goku also put all of his energy into that punch though.

 

[Fantastische Hure]

He did but he just punched through him, there was no real struggle so he didn't have to exert full-power for that long in my opinion.