Vegeta's 'end of Z' speech

[ahill1]

Talking about Vegeta's speech towards Goku when this latter was fighting Kid Boo. How do you take that? Do you think that was Vegeta admitting inferiority? Do you think that implies Vegeta would no longer hold that old obsession in surpassing Goku?

 

[sei'taer]

It's vegeta admitting goku was better than him.

As that's supposed to be the end of the series it's supposed to bring his character arc to a close.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

It's made pretty clear Vegeta is admitting inferiority, though I wouldn't say he completely abandoned the idea of surpassing Goku, seeing as how he still holds onto it in the Kanzenban edition. Most likely, it had more to do with Goku's mindset when pursuing greater strength being purer than Vegeta's that had Vegeta admit Goku was better and he may have even incorporated such into his training thereafter.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

^ exactly like CC said. He admits that Goku is better than him in terms of goals while he on the other hand was fighting for a selfish reason. Hence I hate how GT did to his character and it was too late for them to revive him back.

 

[CONTAK]

I think him saying goku was better was his way of coming to peace with goku being better, in the sense that it won't bother him to the point of doing a stunt like turning majin and killing innocent people. He still wants to be better than goku, since that is in his nature and he would have feelings towards that regardless of what he says.

 

[Spiral-Force]

He was definitely admitting inferiority, but he didn't allude to permanently giving up on the rivalry. It's just that this time he isn't nearly as worked up about Goku being ahead as he used to be, and has more of an appreciation for what Goku fights for and his power increases. Competing with Goku is still something that occupied Vegeta's mind even years later, but not to a detrimental extent.

 

[Pocket-Gog~]

He was definitely admitting inferiority, but he didn't allude to permanently giving up on the rivalry. It's just that this time he isn't nearly as worked up about Goku being ahead as he used to be, and has more of an appreciation for what Goku fights for and his power increases. Competing with Goku is still something that occupied Vegeta's mind even years later, but not to a detrimental extent.

I'd argue the addition in the Kanzenban edition is a disservice to Vegeta's character.

 

[Papasmurf]

Just one quote doesn't ruin his character, AT came up with Galu challenging Vegeta to a fight in space when he realized his clock was ticking in DBO, and that was years before the shitfest of Supa.

 

[Pocket-Gog~]

Eeeeh, Goku and Vegeta having one last fight for good times isn't bad, it's actually really good. However, I take issue with Vegeta's Kanzenban statement. Seen in a vacuum it isn't that bad. However, that line of Vegeta still wanting to fight Goku, I'd say is the start of Vegeta's downfall in characterization.

 

[Spiral-Force]

I'd argue the addition in the Kanzenban edition is a disservice to Vegeta's character.

So choosing not to give up on his goal is a disservice? The speech he made when Goku was fighting Kid Buu doesn't contradict this aim.

 

[Pocket-Gog~]

I'd argue the addition in the Kanzenban edition is a disservice to Vegeta's character.

So choosing not to give up on his goal is a disservice? The speech he made when Goku was fighting Kid Buu doesn't contradict this aim.

But the problem is Vegeta not moving on from this one singular goal, to pursue other things in life. It just hammers in the fact that his character hasn't really progressed at all. He's Goku's rival, always wanting to be better than him. It's the rut Super is stuck in.

 

[Spiral-Force]

But the problem is Vegeta not moving on from this one singular goal, to pursue other things in life. It just hammers in the fact that his character hasn't really progressed at all. He's Goku's rival, always wanting to be better than him. It's the rut Super is stuck in.

How do you know that he didn't have other goals or didn't progress? These are just assumptions that you've made rather than an objective analysis since the Kanzenban ending doesn't confirm these things. I can understand having an issue with how Vegeta is portrayed in Super, but you've yet to properly rationalise how the Kanzenban ending alone does a disservice to him.

 

[CONTAK]

Vegeta has shown a change in his role as a family man with Bulma. Before the ToP, he was willing to stay behind and look after pregnant Bulma instead of going to the tournament. He might always want to be better than Goku but he can grow in other ways. The thing about Super which is very different from GT and Z is that it seems to makes no plans to end and thus the characters are more or less frozen in order to keep telling stories. With stories that have a definite ending, the characters tend to have an arc which once they become who they are you really can't tell the same story with them because they already learned what they needed to learn. So with an ongoing series that has no definite end, you can't give the characters the same type of arc if you want to tell the same type of stories.

It is like how bugs bunny will always be the sort of trickster god who gets the last laugh at Elmer or Daffy, but there is a lot you can do with that. Or how Batman is always the tragic hero who his parents were killed and so he turns to become a vigilante, even though Batman is tied down to that setup, he still has a lot of room to move around in. So with Dragonball, Goku is always the naive fighter who wants to get better and Vegeta always wants to become better than Goku.

 

[Pocket-Gog~]

But the problem is Vegeta not moving on from this one singular goal, to pursue other things in life. It just hammers in the fact that his character hasn't really progressed at all. He's Goku's rival, always wanting to be better than him. It's the rut Super is stuck in.

How do you know that he didn't have other goals or didn't progress? These are just assumptions that you've made rather than an objective analysis since the Kanzenban ending doesn't confirm these things. I can understand having an issue with how Vegeta is portrayed in Super, but you've yet to properly rationalise how the Kanzenban ending alone does a disservice to him.

Alright your point makes more sense than mine.