Yamcha's power (Androids saga)

[ahill1]

Okay, some interesting point about Yamcha's power in the Androids saga, and probably, the other humans as well (unless you assume they are wayyy, like hundreds of times) stronger than Yamcha. I was also the creator of that "Dr. Gero + Z senshi > SSJ Vegeta", which puts the humans really high BP wise, but how about this?


Yamcha is initially confused for Goku by the Android #19, who thinks they finally found Goku:

And #20 said later how he did think Goku more or less "hit" a peak after the battle with Vegeta and couldn't get much stronger, saying he wouldn't have an increase as enormous as before:

Chapter 340 (DBZ 146), P8.6-7
Goku: “I see…But did you spy on the battle on Planet Namek too?”
No.20: “There was no need. By the battle with Vegeta and co., we had already completely grasped your power and techniques. We calculated that no matter how much you improved afterwards, considering your age, you wouldn’t have any increases as enormous as you had before…”

If they got Yamcha confused with Goku, doesn't that mean Yamcha matched their estimation for Goku, which was a power not too far above Goku's peak at the Saiyans saga (32,000 with Kaioken x4)?

 

[Animelover5487]

Yep. It just depends on how strong you think Gero thought Goku could become. He said that he wouldn't have an increase as large as he got in the Saiyan arc, so we know it's not dozens of times. I would personally put Yamcha and Ten just above anyone in the Ginyu Force, in tribute to the anime filler and have Kuririn several times stronger than them to justify how Kuririn is still stronger in the early arcs of Super despite giving up on his training.

 

[withheldforprivacy]

Lately, i believe humans hit their limit at Freeza Saga.

 

[GreatSaiyaman123]

This sounds very weird when you remember Gero build Androids who can finger click Freeza to kill guys weaker than Recoome. Yamcha should at least be 1st or 2nd form Freeza tier by Freeza Arc scaling.

 

[withheldforprivacy]

This sounds very weird when you remember Gero build Androids who can finger click Freeza to kill guys weaker than Recoome. Yamcha should at least be 1st or 2nd form Freeza tier by Freeza Arc scaling.

Gero did not base the Androids' power on the heroes progress, he just made them as strong as he could.
I highly doubt that, if he could create SSJ Blue level Androids, he'd go like ''oh well, no need to bother
with that much power, Freeza Saga level is plenty''.

 

[GreatSaiyaman123]

Why don't he make him and 19 as strong as 16 then? If those guys are supposed to 40k at best, 100k would be more than enough to utterly finish them.

 

[ahill1]

Gero went for the overkill, probably.

 

[withheldforprivacy]

Why don't he make him and 19 as strong as 16 then? If those guys are supposed to 40k at best, 100k would be more than enough to utterly finish them.

Because they were different types of Androids. 19/20 could eventually become stronger than 16 by absorbing energy.

 

[GreatSaiyaman123]

He would build him and 19 on the same model of 16 then. I'd take a lot of time to get on 16 level, specially when they can lose power during fights.

But back on main topic, i still don't see Yamcha being that weak. Why his gains at Kaio would be that drastically different from Piccolo's?
And didn't Gero collected some information during Mecha Freeza Arc?

 

[withheldforprivacy]

He would build him and 19 on the same model of 16 then. I'd take a lot of time to get on 16 level, specially when they can lose power during fights.

Maybe he couldn't build an absorption android on the same model as a fully mechanical one.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

Android Arc is messed up because of Gero's calculation and they're just an estimation really. But I'm gonna put the humans below million at least except for Tien since he managed to pushed Semi Cell.

 

[Void]

I give the humans a little benefit here, they've sensed Freeza and Super Saiyans before and still feel they could be of some possible use. I like to have them lagging behind the pre-RoSaT base Saiyans.

 

[Flame]

Thinking he was Goku makes Yamcha's power about at what Gero predicted it would arise to. My guess is about his level on Namek, it doesn't have to be though, I'd say anywhere in the 1 millions. As long as it was much higher than what the last record was, it makes sense that they would mistake him for Goku.

 

[Pyro]

I remember back in the MFG days people trying to "calculate" what Gero figured Goku's estimated rate of growth would be. So much time wasted trying to figure that shit. I don't think anybody could agree on how strong Yamcha would need to be. I think some people reasoned he would only end up in the low-mid hundred thousands at absolute best, and some argued he would hit the millions at least.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

Gero's "calculation" of Galu's estimated peak seems to be very inconsistent, considering he bothered to say this after taking a full force hit from Base Goku, from which he ought to be able to know Goku's current strength, something that is indeed a tremendous increase from his Saiyan Arc peak.

I'd say the Gero + Z-Senshi > SSJ Vegeta is a far more accurate way of determining the humans' power in this arc. To even bother taking this inconsistent estimation into account, you'd need to also be assuming Yamcha was outputting all of his Ki when he could've easily just been keeping it at a "standing" level like Goku did against Reacoom.

 

[ahill1]

Kuririn seemed worried and afraid when Vegeta launched that blast so Gero would reveal where he was hiding, a blast that Gero absorbed. Does Kuririn's reaction imply Vegeta's blast was way above him? If so, it's tough to treat the humans power being at least somewhat relevant to #20 tipping the scales against SSJ Vegeta while at the same time not having his initial power so weak, which would be the case if we assume the blast's energy he absorbed is simply >> that of the earthlings.



Gero (vs piccolo) -- 230,000,000
Piccolo -- 264,000,000
Gohan -- 30,000,000
Kuririn -- 22,000,000
Tenshinhan -- 18,000,000

Gero (post everyone's energy) -- 300,000,000
SSJ Vegeta -- 300,000,000

base Piccolo -- 35,000,000

I could push base Piccolo to somewhat bigger than Gohan and subtract that to Gero's power pre to Piccolo's absorption:

Gero -- 195,000,000

But then, assuming Kuririn was afraid of SSJ Vegeta's blast as noticed by him saying "we are all here!!" and then assuming such blast was above 20M, as seen in the BPs above, that would force initial Gero to be at most 170,000,000. Thoughts?

 

[SSJ2]

1-20 million.

 

[GreatSaiyaman123]

Between 2,000 and 8,000 is fair enough for him. I say 5 or 6,000.

 

[Pyro]

This is simple now that I go back over the chapter. 19 and Gero didn't have visual confirmation before claiming they had found Goku. Their entire deduction was based on an individual with a power level above known human parameters approaching them. As soon as they visually saw Yamcha, they confirmed the data didn't match and that it was 96% probable to be Yamcha instead.

They guessed incorrectly and without proper knowledge, basically.

 

[ahill1]

Kuririn seemed worried and afraid when Vegeta launched that blast so Gero would reveal where he was hiding, a blast that Gero absorbed. Does Kuririn's reaction imply Vegeta's blast was way above him? If so, it's tough to treat the humans power being at least somewhat relevant to #20 tipping the scales against SSJ Vegeta while at the same time not having his initial power so weak, which would be the case if we assume the blast's energy he absorbed is simply >> that of the earthlings.



Gero (vs piccolo) -- 230,000,000
Piccolo -- 264,000,000
Gohan -- 30,000,000
Kuririn -- 22,000,000
Tenshinhan -- 18,000,000

Gero (post everyone's energy) -- 300,000,000
SSJ Vegeta -- 300,000,000

base Piccolo -- 35,000,000

I could push base Piccolo to somewhat bigger than Gohan and subtract that to Gero's power pre to Piccolo's absorption:

Gero -- 195,000,000

But then, assuming Kuririn was afraid of SSJ Vegeta's blast as noticed by him saying "we are all here!!" and then assuming such blast was above 20M, as seen in the BPs above, that would force initial Gero to be at most 170,000,000. Thoughts?