Vegeta vs Freeza (Round 1)

[GSM123]

This fight isn’t really that close. It’s not even a real fight, more like Freeza is gauging him.

Freeza powers up and charges Vegeta, not knowing he’d become so strong. He’s surprised Vegeta can catch his punch and he’s clearly not goofing around, but there’s no real struggle from Freeza here.

Just look at their faces. Vegeta is crapping himself to hold Freeza here. If Freeza were trying as hard, he would’ve crushed Vegeta.

 

[Power Level Guy]

Oh, it's definitely close. Freeza uses effort and Vegeta's resists him.

Zarbon cannot catch Vegeta's hand like that and physically stop his movement. Vegeta would roll right over Zarbon.

 

[Spiral-Force]

It was the first time Frieza didn't immediately get his way in a combat exchange, so it's viewed more impressively than it actually is. 1st Form Frieza mid diffs him at worst.

 

[Papasmurf]

I wonder why Freeza's aura is colored blue here? Colored auras are almost always yellow (pink in Boo's case).

 

[Animelover5487]

He has to be atleast rivaling 1st Form Freeza for him to think he can beat an estimated transformed Freeza with Gohan and Kuririn's help, who are both considerably weaker unless he was expecting Gohan to get a big rage Amp or something.

 

[Papasmurf]

He has to be atleast rivaling 1st Form Freeza for him to think he can beat an estimated transformed Freeza with Gohan and Kuririn's help, who are both considerably weaker unless he was expecting Gohan to get a big rage Amp or something.

And we know the rage amp he was hoping to get out of Gohan was nowhere near the amp he received when Kuririn got impaled, based on Vegeta's reaction to it

 

[SSJ2]

Freeza was still trying hard there. He was enraged by the prior events, just look at the first strike he throws which Vegeta manages to catch. You almost never see a fighter exerting themselves like Vegeta did even when at 100%. Look at Goku vs Cell. Goku is without a doubt trying his hardest and yet never makes an expression like that... does that mean that he wasn't going all out? Absolutely not.

All it's meant to show is that Vegeta is close to Freeza but not actually on par. That's the best way to show there's still a gap between them despite the engagement itself looking equal.

 

[Spiral-Force]

It's no surprise that Vegeta was primarily team-minded at this stage, as opposed to pressing for a solo win with supposedly 'close' strength. Raw stats were out of the picture, it was a matter of potential:

From his POV:
- Krillin + Gohan would grow to become useful in a fight with an expected transformed Frieza, in which he did not know the depth
- Gohan's rage burst factor, which is wildly inconsistent as far as what it offers for his PL
- He was also banking on the idea of his growth leading to Super Saiyan, which he thought of as invincible

If everything fired on all cylinders for him, particularly the last factor -- which he was the most certain of -- then a partially stronger expected Frieza would seem inconsequential in comparison. Encouraging Frieza to transform doesn't inherently tell us where he and 1st Form Frieza stood.

 

[GSM123]

The closest exchange to that I can find is Goku vs Tien round 2 because they also lock hands. Vegets vs Freeza isn’t even a proper fight, it’s a power comparison.

Freeza isn’t fooling around, but he looks more shocked and pissed than really trying. After that he looks like nothing happened. I don’t think Cell would’ve been as unscathed here. We often gave Vegeta at 480k, but I think 450k is more fitting.

Just noticed something on Gohan’s line too. Might manage something? Surely he’d be more confident than that if Vegeta alone was already almost as strong as Freeza? Or is Gohan still lowballing himself?

 

[SSJ2]

Gohan is just lacking confidence. When you consider his power and Krillin's in comparison to Freeza's, they are nothing. Individually they are one shot fodder to Freeza, it's going to be hard for him to feel confident in any circumstance. 480k is still a fair number for Vegeta. 90% is a distant rival at best, which seemed to match the power display.

 

[Power Level Guy]

The closest exchange to that I can find is Goku vs Tien round 2 because they also lock hands. Vegets vs Freeza isn’t even a proper fight, it’s a power comparison.

When they were legit equals?

 

[GSM123]

When they were legit equals?

Yes. Though I’m leaning towards Goku being stronger - Tenshinhan is too tired to be a true equal.

Gohan is just lacking confidence. When you consider his power and Krillin's in comparison to Freeza's, they are nothing. Individually they are one shot fodder to Freeza, it's going to be hard for him to feel confident in any circumstance. 480k is still a fair number for Vegeta. 90% is a distant rival at best, which seemed to match the power display.

How strong do you have Kuririn and Gohan? If they’re like 60% then they might be 1 shot, but that’s not “nothing”. I think them being ~50% of 1st form Freeza is good: They’re shitting themselves, but if Vegeta can fight then they can help.

Vegeta 450k
Gohan 250k
Kuririn 200k

Vegeta might be slipping out of rivaling range here. Freeza doesn’t even break a sweat!

 

[Power Level Guy]

Yes. Though I’m leaning towards Goku being stronger - Tenshinhan is too tired to be a true equal.

Why do you think Tien is tired?

 

[Animelover5487]

Weighted Goku vs Ten seems to be a skill issue. Popo taught Goku to clear his mind and not make unnecessary movements.

 

[Power Level Guy]

Weighted Goku vs Ten seems to be a skill issue. Popo taught Goku to clear his mind and not make unnecessary movements.

Exactly

 

[GSM123]

Weighted Goku vs Ten seems to be a skill issue. Popo taught Goku to clear his mind and not make unnecessary movements.

This is the only fight ever people use skill/stamina to justify perfomance. Why does nobody attribute Popo’s advantage over Goku to skill?

 

[Power Level Guy]

This is the only fight ever people use skill/stamina to justify perfomance. Why does nobody attribute Popo’s advantage over Goku to skill?

They do when he easily outclasses the Oozaru Fist. Plus, that's exactly what's stated. Goku's skill is what separates him from Tien. It's the narrative broski.

 

[Animelover5487]

This is the only fight ever people use skill/stamina to justify perfomance. Why does nobody attribute Popo’s advantage over Goku to skill?

I mean Popo was outright kicking Goku's ass. Being more skilled doesn't make you stomp someone at rivaling power levels.

 

[GSM123]

They do when he easily outclasses the Oozaru Fist. Plus, that's exactly what's stated. Goku's skill is what separates him from Tien. It's the narrative broski.

Didn’t you say Popo should be like 1.33x Oozaru Fist because he said “Oopsie”?

Roshi literally says they’re not equals.

I mean Popo was outright kicking Goku's ass. Being more skilled doesn't make you stomp someone at rivaling power levels.

If Goku is = Tien but looks >, then Popo can be > but make it look >>.

 

[Power Level Guy]

Being more skilled doesn't make you stomp someone at rivaling power levels.

Yeah, it wasn't like Goku was kicking Tien's ass.

Oozaru Fist Goku probably rivals Popo though, but all Popo did was avoid him.