21st Tenkaichi Budokai Power Level Breakdown

[p123]

Our guidelines are the Orin Temple Bully and Yamcha.

Orin Temple Bully > Krillen (They used to bully Krillen mercilessly)
Yamcha (States for a long time he's been doing nothing but training)

I think Initial Yamcha is 75% of 21st Budokai Yamcha. I think that's a fair boost, Yamcha has been training long and hard, but he has been training by himself and it clearly does not compare to Master Roshi's training. A 1.33x boost seems good here. It puts him well above Initial Goku, but still nothing drastically different. I wouldn't put him above Ox King personally. Who I think had a 1.5-2x boost on Goku.

As we can see, Krillen using his full power and absolutely wrecking the Orin Temple Bully showcases how much more powerful he's gotten in the clearest way. I'd suggest something like a 3x gap for this more or less...


Also, Goku's first fight against the strongman, shows how truly inhumanly powerful he's become. A gigantic circus strongman looking guy gets completely wrecked by a tap. Goku is nowhere near any ordinary level, at least in our world. He's pretty much a god already, which is why Dragonball is so nuts. Most people in the Marvel universe cannot perform that feat.

Bacterian should be rated, his strength is cited as fearsome, his stink even more so, but he should be pretty damn powerful himself.
Krillen is forced to use some effort to dodge his attacks. When Krillen realizes Bacterian's stink fu doesn't effect him, he hits him with a kick that reminds me of Gohan hitting Cell. His face goes crazy and he's one shot KO'd. I think Bacterian being 60-66% of Krillen might be fair here. I see no reason for Krillen to be using anything less than his full power.


Yamcha vs Krillen looks very similar to Goku vs the Ginyu Force. Effortless, epic DB karate master evasiveness going on here. I have this rated at a 60% gap here. I think Yamcha's wolf fang fist climbs that to somewhere around 70% of Jackie Chun. Jackie Chun has to use some effort to get out of the way and speed blitzes to get away from the attack. I'm sure the surprise factor is a factor here too. Yamcha seems to be able to see him out of the corner of his eye but Jackie is moving ridiculously fast.

Krillen vs Jackie starts out with Krillen putting more pressure on Jackie then the Wolf Fang Fist imo, or something close to it. Jackie speed blitzes it. After, Krillen is able to keep up with this level.

They fight on par with each other until Jackie declares that he wants to end it. The return of the epicness returns.

 

[withheldforprivacy]

BODB
Goku (tail)- 100
Yamcha- 90
Goku (no tail)- 80
Krillin- 64

21ST TB
Yamcha- 105
Roshi (initial)- 140
Krillin- 150
Roshi (powered up)- 180
Goku (no tail)- 160
Goku (tail)- 200
Roshi (max)- 200
Nam- 189
Nam (minus yuuki)- 126
Ranfan- 126
Bacterian- 112
Giran- 130

 

[p123]

Yamcha only a 105?

Roshi (Initial) >>= Krillen, he's dodging him with effort, but still dodging like crazy.

Powered Up Roshi > Goku naa, Krillen can keep that level...

Don't waste your time with RanFan.

 

[withheldforprivacy]

1. Yamcha only a 105?

2. Roshi (Initial) >>= Krillin, he's dodging him with effort, but still dodging like crazy.

1. In a scouter free list, i could give him bigger gains.
2. How about raising him to 160?

 

[p123]

Forget about scouters for a second you noob. That's not a good reason to do anything anyhow.

I already went into what I felt about Yamcha, read the damn opening post you fool! Then tell me what you think.

 

[ahill1]

Continuing...

Then Roshi seems to increase his effort and is able to speed blitz Kuririn and punch him into the wall, with the bald guy making a point that he didn't lose only due to the wall. Then, upon seeing Kuririn was able to stand up after his punch, Roshi decides to increase the weight behind it even more, saying he won't take it as easy as before.

Chapter: 42, P2.1
Kuririn: “I only avoided a ring out because I happened to hit the wall. If I get hit with that this time, I’ll really be in trouble…!”
Kame-sennin: “Oh! So you’re not giving up? Well, this time I won’t throw a limp punch like that last one.”

Then, after concentrating, Kuririn can put forth his true ability and is able to keep up with even a Roshi that won't make his punch as weak as before. Even so, Kuririn is at a disadvantage in power and he states as much:

Chapter: 42, P12.2
Kuririn: “In terms of actual ability, Jacky Chun is overwhelmingly superior…I’ll obviously lose if I fight him head-to-head…”

Chapter: ,42 P4.1
Kame-sennin: “It’s been a long time since anyone’s managed to keep up with my speed…”

So far, we have:

Roshi (2nd punch) > Kuririn (concentrating) >=< Roshi (1st punch) >Roshi (initial) >= Kuririn (initial) >>> Yamcha


Then, comes the revelation: Roshi was still not serious against Kuririn, as he stated he'd have to be serious after a long while. He also fears to lose to Goku, and Namu was up there with Goku in a hand to hand combat. Not to mention Roshi didn't believe Goku would wake up after taking Namu's Tenku-Pekeji-Ken, which all in all put Namu fairly close to Roshi and Goku, like 95% or so:


Chapter: 45, P3.2-3
Context: talking about Namu hitting Goku with the Tenku-Pekeji-Ken
Yamcha: “H…he took that head on…”
Kame-sennin: “Mmm…After that, he definitely won’t be able to stand up…”
Namu: “I have faith in the Buddha too…I won’t take a life…However, those hit with this technique will not awaken for 10 days…”



Chapter: 45, P14.5
Kame-sennin: “He…he’s strong...I…I can’t believe it, but I might lose.”


Chapter: 46, P11.1
Kame-sennin: “So, the wild and innocent Goku, huh?…I can’t lose…Even I’ll have to get serious, for the first time in a long time…”


So, the overall chain is:


Goku ~ Roshi (serious) >= Namu > Roshi (2nd punch, finishing kuririn) > Kuririn (concentrating) > Roshi (1st punch) > Roshi (initial) >= Kuririn (initial) >>> Yamcha

 

[p123]

This is how I see it...

Roshi (Serious) >> Roshi(Initial Full Effort) ~ Krillen (Full Effort) > Limp Punch > Krillen (Initial)

 

[ahill1]

I have that as well, I just would put Jackie (increase effort) > Kuririn (FP), since Kuririn admitted inferiority.

I also think Roshi increased his effort when throwing the 1st punch. Roshi (limp punch) > Roshi (initial).

 

[p123]

Nothing about Round 2 of Jackie vs Krillen suggests that they are anything but equals in terms of fighting ability. Krillen must be talking about the power Jackie is clearly holding back.

 

[ahill1]

Kuririn says he won't accomplish much in a hand to hand combat and resort to using strategy (the pants trick). It seems to be about current powers, specially when Kuririn come to this conclusion after losing a "scuffle" against Jackie.

After Jackie coming back to the arena with the KMHMH, Kuririn is clearly desperated and fail completely to hit Jackie Chun with a headbutt, who even mocks him. Even if it's not great, I'd give at least a slight edge to Jackie Chun, like 1.1x or so.

 

[p123]

I think Krillen got a feel for Jackie's power. Clearly Jackie wasn't moving greatly faster against Krillen before. But Krillen had to pick up on something even though they were even.

Jackie then says he should end it, takes his commanding role he had previously and goes all kung fu master on Krillen.

I think Krillen senses Jackie has a shit ton more in the tank and Jackie shows us just how much more he has in their next scuffle.

 

[p123]

Krillen only lost that exchange because he psyched himself out.

 

[ahill1]

I don't see how Kuririn would sense it. His sensing abilities weren't that good at this point, it's arguably if he could even sense chi. I also find it weird he wouldn't mention anything about Jackie Chun's reserve if he felt it.

 

[p123]

So how does he know Jackie is so much stronger when they are fighting evenly?

 

[ahill1]

They didn't exactly fight evenly. Kuririn noted he could see Jackie's movements and after a lot of "strategic" moves, Kuririn got the worse, being kicked by Jackie into the ground and struggling to get up. Right after this, Kuririn concludes Jackie is > him. I don't see it being about a possible FP Jackie, but their current levels.

 

[p123]

The only reason Jackie won that was because Krillen outwitted himself though. Jackie clearly isn't moving so fast that Krillen could make that comment right then and there, that doesn't make sense at all.