Freeza vs Base Saiyans (Boo Saga)

[Six Trails]

When Gohan says Tagoma's power is on par with his own at his best, is he talking about his Base power only?

https://twitter.com/Herms98/status/673308748476112896

According to Herms, yes. But for some reason people seem very insistent on arguing that Gohan is still Ultimate...despite needing Super Saiyan to power up and lacking all of his Ultimate traits...

 

[Evil Vegeta]

Thanks, Mike.

Well, if Base Gohan is about as strong as Tagoma, who easily dominated Piccolo, then the Base Saiyans being weaker than Freeza in the Boo saga seems unlikely now. Base Gohan being regarded as the strongest of the group says a lot, too.

 

[Papasmurf]

I'm on the fence about the half-Ultimate theory for Gohan, honestly. Logically, a weaker Tagoma than the Tagoma-Ginyu should've had his pasty spine ripped in half after SSJ Gotenks nut-shotted him if he's weaker than a run of the mill Super Saiyan 1, yet Gohan beat Tagoma-Ginyu easier than Freeza beat Vegeta on Namek; he also was the strongest of the lot in base against both Tagomas. But then again he is lacking every discernible trait of his Ultimate power up, and even midway into the power up he seemed to "lose" his Super Saiyan form in the Boo arc.

Just Super logic I suppose, although base Saiyans > Piccolo/Freeza/whatever definitely holds more weight because of this.

 

[p123]

Beerus isn't sure if Super Saiyan Goku could have beaten Freeza.

 

[Evil Vegeta]

Beerus: “You’re pretty good. I can see how you managed to defeat Freeza. But if this is all you’ve got, defeating Freeza would probably be the best you’re capable of.”

 

[p123]

He says that after himming and hawwing over if he was indeed strong enough.

 

[Evil Vegeta]

Is that the part where Beers asks him to power-up even more?