Hot take: Bardock special ain't that great

[Future Warrior]

In reality, I think it would have been great if the main character wasn't Goku's father. While I still find it to be leagues above anything Minus showcases, I'd say it's arguably every bit as fanservicey. C'mon now, not only does this random lower class warrior that became good from an accidental fall who later managed to defeat the emperor of the universe, but that same Saiyan happened to have a father that was the only one out of the entire race to retaliate against Freeza? Not only that, but his 10k battle power arguably puts him as being in the top 10 strongest Saiyans in existence? What makes him different from Raditz? Talk about suspending my disbelief.

I think if we take account the context of the whole story when making this special, it would have been far better if the central focus was on a newly created character. I honestly don't see a way for Bardock to be the protagonist of the story without damaging the origins behind Goku's roots in the slightest. Imo, the best role Goku's father would deserve to have would be a small cameo as a random brutish lower class Saiyan, just as Goku was destined to be. Unfortunately, they wanted to take advantage of the potential popularity were they to give someone like Goku's dad a bigger role to play.

To sum things up, the special would be perfect if it wasn't about Goku's dad.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

but that same Saiyan happened to have a father that was the only one out of the entire race to retaliate against Freeza?

Other than King Vegeta and his men. That, and Bardock's struggle amounts to absolutely nothing beyond being a vague memory to Freeza, thereby undercutting the idea of him being hyped up as such a special guy.

Not only that, but his 10k battle power arguably puts him as being in the top 10 strongest Saiyans in existence? What makes him different from Raditz?

Bardock and his team are merely a microcosm of what the Saiyans could have achieved if Freeza had consistently sent then on not just missions, but high level ones. His team weren't even famous or respected enough for Zarbon to recognise them by name, so it's apparent most other low class Saiyans may have been able to grow at such a rate had they had the luck of being handed the right missions that'd help them abuse Zenkais. This is further reinforced in the anime with Raditz saying nobody had injured him as much as Gohan did, making it apparent the Saiyan survivors were very limited when it came to the difficulty of missions they were sent on in an attempt by Freeza to limit the likelihood of them becoming a threat.

 

[Pocket-Gog~]

In reality, I think it would have been great if the main character wasn't Goku's father. While I still find it to be leagues above anything Minus showcases, I'd say it's arguably every bit as fanservicey.

Uh, how is the Bardock special fanservicy? Bardock is always presented as your stereotypical low class Saiyan - a brutish thug who destroys worlds and doesn't even care for his own son. He's cursed to see the future but he can't do a thing to change it and his struggle against Freeza is ultimately just a foot note in history. Its a pretty compelling story all things considered and its proof that Toei when they stretch their writing muscles can put out well written content.

Everything else that concerns Bardock on the otherhand? Now that's fanservice to the nth degree.

 

[Fantastische Hure]

Its a pretty compelling story all things considered and its proof that Toei when they stretch their writing muscles can put out well written content.

i think the credit goes more toward the writers who worked on the tv-special then the company or entirely the ppl working on that. a company can have both good ppl working on that & then some that might be considered not-so-good

 

[Future Warrior]

Other than King Vegeta and his men. That, and Bardock's struggle amounts to absolutely nothing beyond being a vague memory to Freeza, thereby undercutting the idea of him being hyped up as such a special guy.

He was apparently special enough that Freeza actually remembers him by name in the anime, so yeah. Also, the special seems to forget about Vegeta's rebellion as if it never happens. As far as the special was concerned, Goku's father was the only person to tell the future and rebel against Freeza before the final moments of the planets destruction. What a guy.

Bardock and his team are merely a microcosm of what the Saiyans could have achieved if Freeza had consistently sent then on not just missions, but high level ones. His team weren't even famous or respected enough for Zarbon to recognise them by name, so it's apparent most other low class Saiyans may have been able to grow at such a rate had they had the luck of being handed the right missions that'd help them abuse Zenkais. This is further reinforced in the anime with Raditz saying nobody had injured him as much as Gohan did, making it apparent the Saiyan survivors were very limited when it came to the difficulty of missions they were sent on in an attempt by Freeza to limit the likelihood of them becoming a threat.

Yes, the father of the low class Saiyan was the only team to gain the strength of one of the strongest elites in their race. If you want to reference the anime, then its only fair for me to mention that Freeza actually does know Bardock by name. It seemed more like Raditz and his group were just too powerful for any of the inhabitants to pose a real challenge to them. In fact, the Saiyans were going on missions the most out of all the members of the Freeza force. There isn't any real evidence to say Freeza forcefully put them at weaker ones.

It's almost like the things that made Goku special was genetically gained by his father.

The issue isn't whether Bardock left behind a legacy, which he didn't. It's his actions during his life that makes me feel like I'm reading off of some fanfic. Why can't it be about some guy named Lettuce?

 

[Future Warrior]

In reality, I think it would have been great if the main character wasn't Goku's father. While I still find it to be leagues above anything Minus showcases, I'd say it's arguably every bit as fanservicey.

Uh, how is the Bardock special fanservicy? Bardock is always presented as your stereotypical low class Saiyan - a brutish thug who destroys worlds and doesn't even care for his own son. He's cursed to see the future but he can't do a thing to change it and his struggle against Freeza is ultimately just a foot note in history. Its a pretty compelling story all things considered and its proof that Toei when they stretch their writing muscles can put out well written content.

Everything else that concerns Bardock on the otherhand? Now that's fanservice to the nth degree.

Read the rest of my points and you'll see why.

 

[Future Warrior]

Its a pretty compelling story all things considered and its proof that Toei when they stretch their writing muscles can put out well written content.

i think the credit goes more toward the writers who worked on the tv-special then the company or entirely the ppl working on that. a company can have both good ppl working on that & then some that might be considered not-so-good

I'd say the Trunks special is a good example of this. A very nice expansion of a pointless section from the manga.

 

[Pocket-Gog~]

In reality, I think it would have been great if the main character wasn't Goku's father. While I still find it to be leagues above anything Minus showcases, I'd say it's arguably every bit as fanservicey.

Uh, how is the Bardock special fanservicy? Bardock is always presented as your stereotypical low class Saiyan - a brutish thug who destroys worlds and doesn't even care for his own son. He's cursed to see the future but he can't do a thing to change it and his struggle against Freeza is ultimately just a foot note in history. Its a pretty compelling story all things considered and its proof that Toei when they stretch their writing muscles can put out well written content.

Everything else that concerns Bardock on the otherhand? Now that's fanservice to the nth degree.

Read the rest of my points and you'll see why.

I did. The original Bardock special actually helped to reinforce Goku's origins, Goku was a low class Saiyan runt who was considered trash even by his own father. With his visions Bardock would see his son's eventual battle with Freeza, but he has absolutely no factor in the life of the runt he considered trash. Goku will never even know Bardock's name as well.

The whole special reinforces the powerlessness of Bardock, he cannot change his fate, he cannot save the Saiyans, he is not even important enough to be remembered by Freeza. He's not talented enough, good enough, or strong enough to do a single thing. Throughout the whole movie he is tormented by the visions of the Saiyan's fate - just as the race he killed he sees the fate of the Saiyans.

I agree the Bardock special very easily could have become fan servicy if handled by an inferior writer, but I think the whole thing is done tastefully enough that it never crosses into that area.

 

[Future Warrior]

Uh, how is the Bardock special fanservicy? Bardock is always presented as your stereotypical low class Saiyan - a brutish thug who destroys worlds and doesn't even care for his own son. He's cursed to see the future but he can't do a thing to change it and his struggle against Freeza is ultimately just a foot note in history. Its a pretty compelling story all things considered and its proof that Toei when they stretch their writing muscles can put out well written content.

Everything else that concerns Bardock on the otherhand? Now that's fanservice to the nth degree.

Read the rest of my points and you'll see why.

I did. The original Bardock special actually helped to reinforce Goku's origins, Goku was a low class Saiyan runt who was considered trash even by his own father. With his visions Bardock would see his son's eventual battle with Freeza, but he has absolutely no factor in the life of the runt he considered trash. Goku will never even know Bardock's name as well.

The whole special reinforces the powerlessness of Bardock, he cannot change his fate, he cannot save the Saiyans, he is not even important enough to be remembered by Freeza. He's not talented enough, good enough, or strong enough to do a single thing. Throughout the whole movie he is tormented by the visions of the Saiyan's fate - just as the race he killed he sees the fate of the Saiyans.

I agree the Bardock special very easily could have become fan servicy if handled by an inferior writer, but I think the whole thing is done tastefully enough that it never crosses into that area.

Explain how the special reinforces Goku's origins if his father was the last person Freeza saw before destroying the planet and has a battle power stronger than most elites. There's only so much suspension of disbelief I could exhibit. Goku's entire life was due to pure luck, otherwise he would have been just like any other Saiyan. His father was also lucky to have a specific turn of events unfold in his life?

I actually agree that the movie is overall well done and could have been far worse under the wrong supervision. I think the message that you guys are missing is '"How does it benefit the story that it is about Goku's father?''. That's what I want to hear.

 

[Classic Adamas]

I really like the first Bardock special. It's fine for what it is and I appreciate them fleshing out Goku's origins.

The 2011 OVA isn't anything special and was basically just an excuse to give Bardock Super Saiyan, but it was enjoyable.

 

[Papasmurf]

Episode of Bardock was complete trash, and essentially just a slap in the face.

This special in question was OK. Not outstanding, and it fails to make me all that sympathetic for Bardock's character when his race isn't drawn in a sympathetic light and we know how the conflict ends from the start, but a good concept for what it was. It was just lacking in emotional delivery for an ill-fated struggle, which could have been drawn in a much more emotional light with the proper OST and backstory execution for Bardock and his men.

 

[Future Warrior]

Episode of Bardock was complete trash, and essentially just a slap in the face.

This special in question was OK. Not outstanding, and it fails to make me all that sympathetic for Bardock's character when his race isn't drawn in a sympathetic light and we know how the conflict ends from the start, but a good concept for what it was. It was just lacking in emotional delivery for an ill-fated struggle, which could have been drawn in a much more emotional light with the proper OST and backstory execution for Bardock and his men.

I pretty much agree with your stance. I definitely don't dislike it, I just don't put it on the same pedestal as most do.

 

[Papasmurf]

I think Bardock also flashing forward not only to his race's demise, but both his sons' death at the hands of Piccolo in the Saiyan arc (without any further context like Galu later getting revived) earlier in the special could've made for a more convincing transition from a heartless Saiyan low-class to what he became by the end. Instead, the special basically lacked in emotional stakes for me - Bardock was still basically a heartless killer by the end, with the only difference being that he came to care for his second son and entrust the remainder of his revenge to him. It's also only like an hour long which limited the plot directions it could take, and suffered a bit from rushing. Bardock surviving Dodoria's mouth blast even though Dodoria is twice his power level was a pretty cringey attempt at plot armoring too.