How strong is Goku MSSJ (Suppressed / Fresh out of Rosat)?

SIAD

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How strong is Goku MSSJ (Suppressed / Fresh out of Rosat)?

I always thought that he was inferior to Vegeta ASSJ, but now I think that maybe he was far superior to that level. Will he have been at the same level as when he started fighting Cell? In other words, at the level of Perfect Cell (Suppressed against Vegeta and Future Trunks)?

How powerful is that suppressed version of Goku?
 

GreatSaiyaman123

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When Cell is weaker than Vegeta, he says he's just warming up.

Chapter: 382 (DBZ 188), P11.1-4
No.16: “Cell really did get considerably stronger…But Vegeta’s still better than him at everything!”
Vegeta: “Damn you. You’re not taking this seriously.”
Cell: “I told you I was warming-up.”

Super Vegeta > Goku and Cell (Warming up). Goku is only confirmed to surpass Vegeta when he uses 50%.
 

SIAD

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I have: Goku MSSJ (50%) >> SSJ (M8) = Goku MSSJ (Initial vs Cell) >>> Vegeta ASSJ (First Rosat / M8).
 

Kyo

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Will he have been at the same level as when he started fighting Cell?
Serious answer: no. It's stated to be an ordinary, everyday level. Which is kind of unclear this late into the series, but I think we can rule out SSJ-/Cell-esque levels of power of any degree.
 

Hector

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When Cell is weaker than Vegeta, he says he's just warming up.

Chapter: 382 (DBZ 188), P11.1-4
No.16: “Cell really did get considerably stronger…But Vegeta’s still better than him at everything!”
Vegeta: “Damn you. You’re not taking this seriously.”
Cell: “I told you I was warming-up.”

Super Vegeta > Goku and Cell (Warming up). Goku is only confirmed to surpass Vegeta when he uses 50%.
Wait, I thought the power Cell used to defeat Vegeta was the same he used against Goku in the warm-up phase.
 

Natasha Romanoff

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When Cell is weaker than Vegeta, he says he's just warming up.

Chapter: 382 (DBZ 188), P11.1-4
No.16: “Cell really did get considerably stronger…But Vegeta’s still better than him at everything!”
Vegeta: “Damn you. You’re not taking this seriously.”
Cell: “I told you I was warming-up.”

Super Vegeta > Goku and Cell (Warming up). Goku is only confirmed to surpass Vegeta when he uses 50%.
And he is shown dominating him and taking things slight, while Vegeta is tense and nervous, so Cell is emitting a false portion of his power to everyone which only Krillin and Trunks could tell.
 

VampireWicked

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Mastered Super Saiyan is far far superior & stronger than Grade 2 or Grade 3.
But the majority of DragonBall Fans keep looking it terms of strength or power failing to understand it's not simply how strong it is over another form but how it provides in terms of efficiency.

I've said this a billion times on Neo, SuperSaiyan Grade 4 will always be stronger & superior over Grade 1, 2, & 3, because of that efficiency.
What makes it stronger & more superior is that G4 allows that user to have tremendous from training with no drawbacks.

Think of it like working out with the heaviest weights or running at top speed, or swimming lots of laps, or running long jumps, without suffering muscle cramps or muscle soreness etc after working out.
Your work out routine is so refined you get all the benefits with no aches & each time you can work out longer & improve more than the workout before.

Mastering each form provides that benefit of efficiency.
The Elder's Kai Potential Unlock, Ultra-Instinct, SuperSaiyan G4, are efficient forms.
Even what Vegeta figured out & was doing in Super Super Hero was on that path of efficient training.

it signifies the level of performance that uses the least amount of inputs to achieve the highest amount of output.
 

VampireWicked

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Mastered Super Saiyan is far far superior & stronger than Grade 2 or Grade 3.
But the majority of DragonBall Fans keep looking it terms of strength or power failing to understand it's not simply how strong it is over another form but how it provides in terms of efficiency.

I've said this a billion times on Neo, SuperSaiyan Grade 4 will always be stronger & superior over Grade 1, 2, & 3, because of that efficiency.
What makes it stronger & more superior is that G4 allows that user to have tremendous from training with no drawbacks.

Think of it like working out with the heaviest weights or running at top speed, or swimming lots of laps, or running long jumps, without suffering muscle cramps or muscle soreness etc after working out.
Your work out routine is so refined you get all the benefits with no aches & each time you can work out longer & improve more than the workout before.

Mastering each form provides that benefit of efficiency.
The Elder's Kai Potential Unlock, Ultra-Instinct, SuperSaiyan G4, are efficient forms.
Even what Vegeta figured out & was doing in Super Super Hero was on that path of efficient training.

it signifies the level of performance that uses the least amount of inputs to achieve the highest amount of output.
I'm not trying to insult anyone or one up anyone or win some stupid debate here but this is a concept that should've been one of the easiest to grasp, & it was explained in the material itself.
So I'll try to give as many simplified examples & explanations as I think up while repeating the word efficiency as much as possible, cause lord knows I'm going to again in so other topic in the future & I'll use em as my go to line of thought on the subject lol.

SuperSaiyan Grade 4 is what happens when making a flawed or unrefined form as efficient as possible.
SuperSaiyan Grade 4 equals Efficient.

This is like the difference between.....
Training one's self vs Training against another vs by Being training by a teacher vs Being trained by a Master.
Like chopping down a tree with a dull axe vs chopping down a tree with a chainsaw.

The less efficient you are, the harder things will be & the more you will struggle to reach your goal & the longer it will take you.
Like struggling to destroy a small moon vs casually destroying an entire solar system.

Say there's two DragonBall Z characters with the exact same PowerLevels, better yet there's an exact copy of the same character, a Goku A & Goku B Both have a starting PowerLevel of 150Million set to train for a full year & the goal is to reach 170 Million.
Yet Goku A is training along while Goku B is training with Whis.
After both are done.
Goku A reaches a PowerLevel of 180Million after training for 245 days.
Goku B however reaches a PowerLevel of 210Million after only 135 days.

The more efficient way of training wins out as it allows Goku B to effectively reach that goal & causally surpass it in less time & effort.

This is a great subject to explore & discuss because it gives a better understanding to power progression & how easy or hard it is to achieve.

Something else that was dove into on Neo that I really think is apart of this Universe too thanks to Voice on Neo.
I'll start a Thread.
 

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