Hector's DBZ list including fillers and movies (Volume 2: Early Androids Saga)

[Hector]

The first volume HERE.

Note: Now that SSJ gets into the picture, each SSJ has two bases: his normal base and one that gives him access to 25% of SSJ's power.

MOVIE 5: COOLER'S REVENGE
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The movie takes place during the 3-year period between Freeza and Androids Sagas. It must be in the future timeline, since nobody seems to be preparing for the Androids, though I think the movie's events played out in the same way more or less in the other timelines too. Vegeta is probably training in outer space.
Goku is stated to be stronger than he was when he got back to Earth, and the Goku who got back to Earth is obviously Yardrat Goku.
Piccolo and Salza are somewhat weaker than Goku's normal base. The sum of Dore's and Naize's PLs is a little higher than Salza's PL, since that was the case with Ginyu and his minions, whom Cooler's henchmen obviously mirror in this movie. Gohan and Krillin are as strong as last time we saw them.

Gohan- 1.05 million

Krillin- 1 million

Piccolo- 16 million

Salza- 14 million

Dore- 8 million

Neiz- 7 million

Goku- 20 million
second base- 250 million
second base (2x Kaioken): 500 million
SSJ- 1 billion

Cooler- 240 million
transformed- 720 million

ANDROIDS SAGA (PART 1)
​

Piccolo is weak SSJ level, so I have him equal to Trunks as he was last time we saw him, and the Androids are twice that powerful. It is not clear how long Trunks stayed in the future, but in comparisons, he's still treated as the same person who slew Freeza, so I won't give him large gains. Humans are 10x stronger than before so they're somewhat relevant to Saiyans' normal base powers.

Piccolo
weighted- 15 million
unweighted- 750 million

Krillin- 10 million

Tenshinhan- 8 million

Yamcha- 5 million

Gohan- 12 million

Goku- 22 million
second base- 275 million
SSJ- 1.1 billion (starts out at full power and rapidly decreasing due to sickness)

Nineteen- 500 million
post absorptions- 700 million

Twenty- 550 million
post absorptions- 600 million

Vegeta- 23 million
second base- 287.5 million
SSJ- 1.15 billion

Alternate Trunks- 16 million
second base- 200 million
SSJ- 800 million

Eighteen- 1.5 billion

Seventeen- 1.5 billion

Piccolo (post Kami)
weighted- 1.35 billion
unweighted- 1.5 billion

Imperfect Cell- 1.2 billion

HISTORY OF TRUNKS
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Alternate Seventeen- 1.125 billion

Alternate Eighteen- 1.125 billion

Alternate Gohan (two arms)- 22 million
second base- 275 million
SSJ- 1.1 billion

Alternate Gohan (one arm)- 26 million
second base- 325 million
SSJ- 1.3 billion

Alternate Trunks (teen)- 10 million
second base- 125 million (because he's so close to becoming SSJ, he could access his second base in the first fight with the Androids, before he transformed for the first time)
SSJ- 500 million

Alternate Trunks (adult)- 14 million
second base- 175 million
SSJ- 700 million

MOVIE 7: SUPER 13
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The movie takes place in the unseen timeline where only Trunks comes from the future and there is no Cell. The Z-Fighters have found some way of dealing with the Androids and are now enjoying peace. The SSJs are their Early Android Saga selves. Piccolo is stronger than the SSJs, since he managed to make Super 13 budge, so he's obviously Kamiccolo.

Goku- 22 million
second base- 275 million
SSJ- 1.1 billion

Vegeta- 23 million
second base- 287.5 million
SSJ- 1.15 billion

Gohan- 12 million

Krillin- 10 million

Alternate Trunks- 16 million
second base- 200 million
SSJ- 800 million

Piccolo
weighted- 1.35 billion
unweighted- 1.5 billion

Thirteen- 1.15 billion

Fourteen- 750 million

Fifteen- 900 million

Super Thirteen (Fourteen's/Fifteen's powers were added to his own)- 2.8 billion

Goku (spirit bomb/4x)- 4.4 billion

MOVIE 6: COOLER RETURNS
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The movie takes place in the same timeline as Movie 7, but the events of Movie 7 precede those of Movie 6. Trunks has gone back to his timeline. Goku and Vegeta are somewhat stronger than before, but still not as strong as Kamiccolo, who loses to Meta Cooler one on one.

Piccolo
weighted- 1.35 billion
unweighted- 1.5 billion

Gohan- 12 million

Krillin- 10 million

Robots- 9.5 million (really hard armor)

Goku- 25 million
second base- 312.5 million
SSJ- 1.25 billion

Vegeta- 25 million
second base- 312.5 million
SSJ- 1.25 billion

Meta Cooler- 1.1 billion
repaired- 1.65 billion

 

[GSM123]

17 = 18?

As for the movies, what about Kaio-Ken? Goku still uses Kaio-Ken in Movie 5 and 6 but Cooler bodies him both times. Goku is also said to be the strongest in Movie 5, so either he's above Kamiccolo or Piccolo isn't fused in this film.

 

[Hector]

1. 17 = 18?

2. As for the movies, what about Kaio-Ken? Goku still uses Kaio-Ken in Movie 5 and 6 but Cooler bodies him both times. Goku is also said to be the strongest in Movie 5, so either he's above Kamiccolo or Piccolo isn't fused in this film.

1. 17>18 is a manga thing. In the anime, there is nothing that indicates those two can't be equal.

2. Maybe it's Kaioken 1.5x. When was Goku stated to be the strongest in Movie 5?

 

[Dagon]

Second base is what?

4th form Cooler should be weaker than Freeza, or at best his equal. Base Goku was said to be enough to have beaten Freeza by Cooler. Also, Super Dragon Ball heroes kind of confirmed the in-between state where Cooler has the raised shoulder pads is his 100% power state because we see Golden Metal Cooler in that form.

1. 17>18 is a manga thing. In the anime, there is nothing that indicates those two can't be equal.

You'd need an affirmation that they are equal. I'm fairly certain the anime still has 17 claiming to be the strongest being.

 

[GSM123]

@Hector

Spoiler

Kaio-Ken 1.5x doesn’t exist, and neither of the Cooler movies shows any impressive Base Saiyan feat. In fact, sandwiching two very impressive tanks between a 60% gap (Cooler vs KK Goku and then SSJ Goku vs Cooler) is probably not a good idea.

 

[Hector]

@Hector

Spoiler

View attachment 2147
View attachment 2148

Kaio-Ken 1.5x doesn’t exist, and neither of the Cooler movies shows any impressive Base Saiyan feat. In fact, sandwiching two very impressive tanks between a 60% gap (Cooler vs KK Goku and then SSJ Goku vs Cooler) is probably not a good idea.

That sounds as if they believe he's the strongest in the universe just because he's a Super Saiyan, a notion that was debunked soon after Freeza Saga. I think the writers just wanted that movie to mirror Freeza Saga as much as possible. But since, in my books, I place that movie after Androids Saga, when the Super Saiyan is the strongest myth has been more than debunked, I can safely ignore that statement.

Kaioken 1.5x exists. Gaps are inconsistent anyway. And we always have the theory presented in the Bringer of Death fanfic, so that might have been a kaioken 1.2x or something.

 

[Dagon]

Kaioken 1.5x exists.

Source please.

 

[Hector]

Source please.

Common sense. Vegeta's power-up in the Saiyans Saga was implied to be a huge deal, which doesn't make sense if he was already at 90% of his full power.

 

[GSM123]

~ Gaps are inconsistent anyway
~ Vegeta’s power up doesn’t make sense if he was at 90%

 

[Dagon]

Common sense. Vegeta's power-up in the Saiyans Saga was implied to be a huge deal, which doesn't make sense if he was already at 90% of his full power.

Sounds like a you problem.
Also, common sense fallacy.
It would more precisely be 88.8%. Just means increases that small are considered a big deal.

 

[Hector]

~ Gaps are inconsistent anyway
~ Vegeta’s power up doesn’t make sense if he was at 90%

I could reduce the second base. The thing is, second base being 40% of SSJ power justifies some Base Saiyan feats (e.g. Goku's punch to Dr Gero) and is consistent with a DBGT line. Maybe Cooler somewhat amplified his power when he went through the KK/KHH attack by gaining momentum (like Gohan's headbutt against Raditz)?

 

[Hector]

In fact, sandwiching two very impressive tanks between a 60% gap (Cooler vs KK Goku and then SSJ Goku vs Cooler) is probably not a good idea.

I changed the second base multiplier. Second base is now 25% of SSJ.