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I don't think that works. Majin Vegeta's full power as a Super Saiyan is showing when Badibi pushes him past his limits. He's straining with everything he's got, there's no time for suppression. Everyone's face looks on in horror as Vegeta's Majin power is brought out. We know Vegeta isn't...

Which means the boys should kept as close as possible to them. As close as possible seems to be something like 5-10x weaker than the adults. That’s what the combined strength implications suggest. Fat Buu might be around 50x stronger than Vegeta. The numbers go wacky in the Buu Saga.

That can’t be since they are weaker than Piccolo.

This is a great conservative list to play with here. Let's try it out. Goku 100 Vegeta 80 Gohan 60 Pui Pui 45 Expected Saiyans 30 Shin 25 Piccolo 15 Boys Post 12 Boys Pre 8 Android 18 7.5 This is solid, is it not? Hmmm, I feel like we are getting closer and closer here. Surely we can...

Yeah, let's try that angle. Ssj Goku > Ssj Vegeta > Ssj2 Gohan/Dabura What problems do we run into? Doesn't this solve a whole bunch of issues for us?

Training with a Super Saiyan is helpful site, but the potential needs to be there. I think the main reason Piccolo progressed so much is that his potential radically increased when he fused with Nail. Regular Piccolo is below Base Saiyans but Nail/Piccolo is only below regular Super Saiyans. I...

How would you account for Gohan thinking he could defeat the Androids then if a much stronger Vegeta couldn’t? Piccolo easily surpassed the Base Saiyans in the Android Saga, why wouldn’t that be the case here as well?

Probably weaker than Ssj Gohan

They amp the ki

But he could never expect to win

Their reserves have nothing to do with total power. Reserves are meaningless here. You can’t fight at a higher level than your ki output.

I hear what you are saying. But it still wouldn’t mean someone’s ki is less than their power.

I don’t think I buy that. Fighters maintain their full power for a long period of time. You can physically see a fighter exerting full power for a full round or two. Look at someone like Conor McGregor, a super explosive athlete who is known to burn out who fights with a very aggressive style...

Piccolo hasn’t powered up? He was very strong against Frost.

And? Fighters do that all the time and are able to fight at their maximum for many rounds. Why could Piccolo do the same?

I’d have to see the quotes.

This analogy makes sense to me. however. No, because the amount of power he’s using is insignificant to his total power. think of it more like this. He has 100 ki points, but every point has 1,000 units of energy in it. So he can exhaust a lot without his power dropping.

Do you really think AT was thinking like this?

It looks pretty good. Listen, it’s reality. We didn’t write this saga, AT made this mess of a story we are doing our best to numerically assign values to his nonsense. you think this is bad I’m going to end up with Ssj3 being a 50x boost. Lol

You are using ki suppression to justify this? How does that make sense? fighters cannot, I repeat, cannot output more energy than they are giving off minus suppression.