1st Form Freeza must be > Vegetto

[Cirno777]

@Dagon What's your reasoning?

 

[Power Level Guy]

It would seem to me he does.

Seems like a pretty solid case.

Fusion is based off of what? Is it exponential. And who are you? You seem to be very knowledgeable and detailed. Is this your usual name, what names have you gone by before?

 

[Cirno777]

Seems like a pretty solid case.

Fusion is based off of what? Is it exponential.

The official guide statements on the fusion multiplier is:
Matamoru = Power X Power
Potara = Battle Power X Battle Power

Spoiler

So it would be Goku x Vegeta.
That doesn't really have much predictive power though, as the numbers used can be up to interpretation. A minimal estimate however can be used based on statements on Matamoru Fusion:

Spoiler

"ふたりの人間の力や体の大きさが、ごく近い場合にだけ合体できる術で、ふたりが合体することにより、それぞれの術者をはるかに超えるパワーと技を持つ別の人格の人物が誕生する。"
"It is a technique that can only be used to merge two people if they are very close in power and size, and when two people merge, they create different personalities with power and skills far beyond those of their respective practitioners."

Through the Fusion technique, a fighter with power surpassing the fusees is created. This would suggest that the starting level for a fusion is to surpass the fusees at their maximum form.
For example, this would mean Buu Saga Base Gogeta > Buu Saga SSJ3 Goku.
I use that as a starting point. Of course, the degree to which the fusion surpasses is another thing. It could be something like 5x based on the Broly Saga though.

And who are you? You seem to be very knowledgeable and detailed. Is this your usual name, what names have you gone by before?

Thanks I guess. I joined this forum about a year ago, under this same name. I don't come on here too often tbh.

 

[Power Level Guy]

Through the Fusion technique, a fighter with power surpassing the fusees is created. This would suggest that the starting level for a fusion is to surpass the fusees at their maximum form.
For example, this would mean Buu Saga Base Gogeta > Buu Saga SSJ3 Goku.
I use that as a starting point. Of course, the degree to which the fusion surpasses is another thing. It could be something like 5x based on the Broly Saga though.

Yeah, it definitely seems like Base manages to always surpass the highest form. I wonder how to make that into a formula though.

And fusion does appear to be exponential. You should join us at our server and help work on a fusion formula, it would be fun.

 

[Dagon]

Is cirno Hitrule's dupe?

 

[GreatSaiyaman123]

Cirno has been around here before Hitrule, and I know Hitrule from before. They're not the same person just because they agree on something.

 

[SIAD]

@Cirno777 So: Vegetto SSJ3 (Arc Boo) > Ultimate Gokhan Potara (Arc Boo)?

 

[Cirno777]

Nah, Hitrule is MY dupe.

 

[Cirno777]

@SIAD
Yup.

 

[SIAD]

@SIAD
Yup.

@Cirno777 I have the following questions:

1.- Would Gokhan have access to the Ultimate state?

2.- When it is said that Vegetto is the strongest fusion, since the most powerful thing Vegetto showed was SSJ, would that mean that: Vegetto SSJ > Ultimate Gokhan or Gokhan SSJ3? Or is he just referring to Vegetto SSJ3 > Ultimate or SSJ3 Gokhan?

How accurate is that Legendary Manga? I'm not very familiar with the guides.

 

[Cirno777]

1.- Would Gokhan have access to the Ultimate state?

I would expect that he would, though I can't really be sure.

2.- When it is said that Vegetto is the strongest fusion, since the most powerful thing Vegetto showed was SSJ, would that mean that: Vegetto SSJ > Ultimate Gokhan or Gokhan SSJ3? Or is he just referring to Vegetto SSJ3 > Ultimate or SSJ3 Gokhan?

It is implied through the old Kaioushin's dialogue, that the strongest Potara combination is one of two rivals, Goku and Vegeta.
Vegetto is also called the strongest combination, or that Goku and Vegeta are the strongests combination in multiple guides.
See my previous posts for the images and such.

How accurate is that Legendary Manga? I'm not very familiar with the guides.

Spoiler

According to the blurb on the first page of each volume, the original text was created in Japan by Shueisha, and translated into Spanish for EML. I think there's also a French version, but I don't have that one.

Anyway, it should be reliable as a source, Shueisha has the copyright and publishing rights for DB.

 

[SIAD]

I would expect that he would, though I can't really be sure.


It is implied through the old Kaioushin's dialogue, that the strongest Potara combination is one of two rivals, Goku and Vegeta.
Vegetto is also called the strongest combination, or that Goku and Vegeta are the strongests combination in multiple guides.
See my previous posts for the images and such.

Spoiler

View attachment 3017

According to the blurb on the first page of each volume, the original text was created in Japan by Shueisha, and translated into Spanish for EML. I think there's also a French version, but I don't have that one.

Anyway, it should be reliable as a source, Shueisha has the copyright and publishing rights for DB.

@Cirno777

What you say is true, perhaps Gokhan Base is the result of Goku Base and Gohan Base (Post Espada Z). The difference in power is not that great and the rival's momentum must be greater.

I'm willing to believe that Vegetto > Gokhan (Potara). However, I have Ultimate Gokhan (Dance Fusion) > Gogeta SSJ3. Since there is nothing to indicate that the dance fusion has a rival impulse.

 

[Cirno777]

What you say is true, perhaps Gokhan Base is the result of Goku Base and Gohan Base (Post Espada Z). The difference in power is not that great and the rival's momentum must be greater.

I'm willing to believe that Vegetto > Gokhan (Potara). However, I have Ultimate Gokhan (Dance Fusion) > Gogeta SSJ3. Since there is nothing to indicate that the dance fusion has a rival impulse.

I agree with you. It is possible that the Matamoru Fusion gets the rival amp, but there is no proof for it. All statements for it are made in reference to Potara fusion.

 

[SIAD]

I agree with you. It is possible that the Matamoru Fusion gets the rival amp, but there is no proof for it. All statements for it are made in reference to Potara fusion.

I have:

Ultimate Gokhan (Matamoru) >>> Gokhan SSJ3 (Matamoru) = Gogeta SSJ3

And:

Vegetto SSJ3 > Ultimate Gokhan (Potara) >>> Vegetto SSJ > Gokhan SSJ3 (Potara) >>> Gokhan Base > Gohan Boo >= Vegetto Base.

 

[Cirno777]

@SIAD
I have:

Super Vegetto 3 > Ultimate/SSJ3 Gokuhan > Super Vegetto > Base Vegetto > Base Gokuhan ~ Buuhan > Buutenks

 

[SIAD]

@Cirno777 What is the first DBGT character to surpass a hypothetical SSJ3 Vegetto (Arc Boo)?

 

[Cirno777]

@Cirno777 What is the first DBGT character to surpass a hypothetical SSJ3 Vegetto (Arc Boo)?

Probably like Yi Xing Long or something. I don't have much knowledge with GT though.

 

[SIAD]

Probably like Yi Xing Long or something. I don't have much knowledge with GT though.

I have: Goku SSJ4 (Initial) >>>>> Vegetto SSJ3 (Arc Boo).

 

[Cirno777]

I have: Goku SSJ4 (Initial) >>>>> Vegetto SSJ3 (Arc Boo).

I've got Super Vegetto > SSJ4 Goku (Baby Saga).