Current Blue Goku > UI?

[Future Warrior]

I don't why but Goku seems to fight equally with a Jiren that's powered up more than he was against UI Goku.

 

[supersaiyangodgogeta]

No. SSB Goku isn't implied or shown to be any stronger than when he fought Jiren the first time. Trading blows means nothing. This powered up Jiren was tens of times stronger than the Goku that he was "trading blows" with. Might as well say that the Trio de dangers got tens of times stronger in seconds since they were able to trade blows with the base and SSJ saiyans.

 

[VampireWicked]

No. SSB Goku isn't implied or shown to be any stronger than when he fought Jiren the first time. Trading blows means nothing. This powered up Jiren was tens of times stronger than the Goku that he was "trading blows" with. Might as well say that the Trio de dangers got tens of times stronger in seconds since they were able to trade blows with the base and SSJ saiyans.

It was implied & stated repeatedly Goku has gotten stronger.
His fight against Kale & Caulifla, & against Kefla.


The fight against Kefla it was stated Kefla rivaled the SpiritBomb.
It was stated repeatedly BOTH Kefla & Goku's power was constantly rising.
Whis says their energy is getting stronger,
Goku as a SuperSaiyan Blue matched her.

It was also stated by Whis

Exposure to repeated extreme conditions can lead to acclimation.

The bar may be getting raised on his opportunity to break his own shell.

Meaning Goku's limits has increased so the same level of attack as previously will not be enough to induce Ultra-Instinct.

And Goku fought Android17 & was forced into going SuperSaiyan Blue etc.
While during the tournament of power in the Pretty Black Hole Android17 & Android18 could not stand, yet Goku in base stood up went SuperSaiyan Blue & blasted free.

@Future Warrior@
Also to be honest i don't actually see any of this as random BS scaling gone wrong or whatever.
I think it makes absolute sense.

The Tournament Of Power is actually a great thing for them & everyone involved because they're gaining experience from a variety of fighters within a time span of 48minutes instead of waiting possibly years in between such challenges.

Look at DragonBall Z & the time gap between such major enemies.

The Tournament Of Power characters are gaining experience, gaining strength, facing multiple opponents strong opponents in one area in 48 minutes really pushing them to their absolute limits.

Every character involved should come out much crazy stronger, it would be ridiculous for them not too.

 

[supersaiyangodgogeta]

Not much to address. It was never stated anywhere that Goku was stronger than he was previously. Goku's blue power rising doesn't mean that he was stronger than before. He just wasn't at full power initially against Kefla.

Android 17 wasn't at full power so it's moot.

And no, Whis's statement doesn't mean what you're saying. You can see what it's saying by reading it. No interpretation required. It will take more to get Goku to Ultra Instinct since he's used to the conditions. Nothing about a power increase.

 

[VampireWicked]

Not much to address. It was never stated anywhere that Goku was stronger than he was previously. Goku's blue power rising doesn't mean that he was stronger than before. He just wasn't at full power initially against Kefla.

Android 17 wasn't at full power so it's moot.

And no, Whis's statement doesn't mean what you're saying. You can see what it's saying by reading it. No interpretation required. It will take more to get Goku to Ultra Instinct since he's used to the conditions. Nothing about a power increase.

No Goku wasn't at full power against Kale & Caulifla yet until he went SuperSaiyan Blue in Episode 115 against Kefla, where he says if he continues holding back things could be bad.

Goku being exhausted is kinda a shaky point as Goku has been exhausted using Kaioken x20 against Jiren, fighting in base, SuperSaiyan, & other transformations, then applying Kaioken a technique that places even more strain on his body.

he was also able to equal her when she's able to rival the SpiritBomb suggests there's obvious strength increases.

How would Android17 not be at full power when he has a limitless supply.
Are you suggesting at that moment in the Pretty Black Hole Android17 was holding back.

As i said it was stated quite a few times Kefla & Goku's power was rising, since Beerus, Whis, Krillin, Piccolo, Gohan, etc etc etc etc can sense power levels, Beerus & Whis especially while Goku/Vegeta are in GOD form, they would have no reason to suggest Goku's power was rising when they're very familiar with what he had going in.

If there was no increase then it would've been stated as simply Kefla's power is rising while Goku's is recovering his & heavily stated that if Goku was fully recovered Kefla wouldn't be a match for him period.

So as it was conveyed there's more saying both got increases in power level, not just Kefla.

 

[supersaiyangodgogeta]

Goku doesn't say anything about him using all of his strength in blue right there and then, so it's moot. He told 17 "that 17 wasn't using full power before either", which means that Goku was at full power. He wasn't using all of his blue strength against 17, so he's talking about blue itself being his full power. And this is all made obvious when Goku is still equal to SSB Vegeta, whom he was equal to at the start of the tournament.

All rising means is that it was increasing from his previous level. You're construing it to mean something it doesn't.
And she knocked him out with one kick after she got serious so no they weren't equal. And we already know that Spirit Bomb>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>SSB Goku since he expected to take Jiren out with it.

Androids can hold back. The first time he's shown visibly at full power is against Anilaza, so base Goku standing up is moot when we already know that Android 17>>>>>>>>SSJ Goku and is around Ultimate Gohan whom rivals SSB Goku.

 

[VampireWicked]

Goku doesn't say anything about him using all of his strength in blue right there and then, so it's moot. He told 17 "that 17 wasn't using full power before either", which means that Goku was at full power. He wasn't using all of his blue strength against 17, so he's talking about blue itself being his full power. And this is all made obvious when Goku is still equal to SSB Vegeta, whom he was equal to at the start of the tournament.

Ignoring points does not make something moot.

Again in the Pretty Black Hole Android17 was unable to stand, whereas Goku in base form stood up.

All rising means is that it was increasing from his previous level. You're construing it to mean something it doesn't.

They would not've included Kefla in that statement if that was the meaning behind it.
The tournament of power is full on battle experience, it's unrealistic to think there would not no power gain in this type of situation when they train using non-battle royal methods achieving an increase in strength.

And she knocked him out with one kick after she got serious so no they weren't equal. And we already know that Spirit Bomb>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>SSB Goku since he expected to take Jiren out with it.

Kefla caught Goku off guard with a blind sided kick, she didn't overpower him.

Androids can hold back. The first time he's shown visibly at full power is against Anilaza, so base Goku standing up is moot when we already know that Android 17>>>>>>>>SSJ Goku and is around Ultimate Gohan whom rivals SSB Goku.

Makes absolutely no sense to hold back & get him & his sister crushed by the Pretty Black Hole.

 

[supersaiyangodgogeta]

Unless you can prove that 17 was at full power then it's moot. We already know that 17>>>>SSJ Goku, so your argument is already debunked right then and there and we already know that he finally went all out against Anilaza due to him powering up which he never did at any other point in the tournament.

The statement means that their ki was rising from their previous level. Nothing else. It's a non argument. Kefla being involved means that both their ki was rising. Again, construing the statement to mean something outside of it's definition.

Nowhere was it stated that Goku got caught off guard. She was simply too fast and strong for him to keep up with after she got serious.

 

[VampireWicked]

Unless you can prove that 17 was at full power then it's moot. We already know that 17>>>>SSJ Goku, so your argument is already debunked right then and there and we already know that he finally went all out against Anilaza due to him powering up which he never did at any other point in the tournament.

The statement means that their ki was rising from their previous level. Nothing else. It's a non argument. Kefla being involved means that both their ki was rising. Again, construing the statement to mean something outside of it's definition.

Nowhere was it stated that Goku got caught off guard. She was simply too fast and strong for him to keep up with after she got serious.

Do you know what MOOT means ?



..............................Waaaaaaait, are you screwing with me?