Prime Garp vs current Kaido

[ahill1]

Who wins this fuckery?

 

[SSJ2]

Harp wins pretty easily.

Edit: Maybe not easily, but he should win this with mid difficult at most. Roger, Garp, WB and Shiki were on another level in their prime.

 

[Future Warrior]

Harp wins pretty easily.

Edit: Maybe not easily, but he should win this with mid difficult at most. Roger, Garp, WB and Shiki were on another level in their prime.

I'm not sure it would be anything less than a high diff fight. I think it's like the Yonko vs Admiral situation.

 

[SSJ2]

Yea it might be. I just don't think that Kaido has displayed close to the same level of Haki that we saw Roger/WB using, and Garp was a very close rival to them.

 

[Future Warrior]

I think Yonko vs Roger would be a high diff fight personally.

 

[ahill1]

Well, Garp still stalemate Shiki when he was fighting in conjuction with Sengoku... so he seems to be noticeably behind prime Roger and Whitebeard, imo.

 

[SSJ2]

Shiki is pretty well Roger's equal. Garp was implied to be Roger's rival but not necessarily his equal.

Roger: 105
WB: 105
Shiki: 100+
Garp/Sengoku: 90-95

I don't think it works like in DB where 2 near equal powers would easily beat a slightly stronger one. Shiki wouldn't be an easy win even with their combined efforts.

 

[Future Warrior]

Can someone tell me what indication there is that Sengoku is on par with Roger? I'm not doubting anybody my memory is just shaky. I know he was a fleet admiral but he didn't seem all that special during the MF war.

 

[SSJ2]

He's implied to be around Garp's level when both were in their prime. In chapter 0 the Marines viewed them as equals more or less. Sengoku was past his prime at Marineford.

 

[Future Warrior]

How strong do you think he was during MF?

 

[SSJ2]

Probably around or equal to the Admirals.

 

[ahill1]

If I did some numbers

Roger 112.5
Whiteboard 110
Shiki 110
Garp 90
Whitebeard (Marineford) 90
Kaido 85

Does that make sense? Even tho WB was awakened, I struggle to have him below prime Garp given the way both him and Sengoku looking at his feats. I don't suppose he should fall behind them.

 

[SSJ2]

Prime Garp is stronger than you’re giving him credit for.

 

[ahill1]

Well, where's it stated he's a rival to Roger and Whitebeard?

 

[SSJ2]

Roger literally states that Garp had almost killed him on many occasions. There are also other implications that they were around the same level, such as the God Valley incident.

 

[ahill1]

Well, we don't know the time in which Garp almost killed Roger, do we? I can see Luffy also stating that to someone like Smoker.

The God Valley was also when the pirates were far from their prime iirc.

 

[SSJ2]

Nah not all. Only Big Mom and Kaido were said to have gotten much stronger since then. Rocks Xebec was also said to be the strongest enemy Roger had ever faced, and somehow he and Garp beat him, Shiki, WB, BM, Kaido, and several more.

They can't have been too far from their primes.

 

[Future Warrior]

If I did some numbers

Roger 112.5
Whiteboard 110
Shiki 110
Garp 90
Whitebeard (Marineford) 90
Kaido 85

Does that make sense? Even tho WB was awakened, I struggle to have him below prime Garp given the way both him and Sengoku looking at his feats. I don't suppose he should fall behind them.

I think Whitebeard was arguably the weakest Yonko during the MF due to his sickness. The dude could barely use basic Observation and Conquerors Haki.

 

[SSJ2]

Yea the recent discovery of advanced Haoshoku has made me question that. But still, even half dead with half his head missing, he was capable of messing up Akainu with Busoshoku alone. Whitebeard could have been much stronger than them while healthy that even without advanced Haki he was still their equal..

Another possibility is that advanced Haki doesn't have such a dramatic effect the stronger you are. Kaido was able to fight with Oden who didn't have advanced Haoshoku to our knowledge, and Oden was able to clash with prime Whitebeard and survive an attack from Roger with no damage. Kaido now has advanced Haoshoku and isn't made out to be a great deal stronger than he was back then. The gains from advanced Haoshoku are probably much greater if you're as weak as Luffy.

 

[Future Warrior]

Also I'm starting to think Garp probably has Haoshoku Haki, using the advanced version. It makes sense why he's one of the strongest yet has no DF.