"Saiyans get stronger after every fight"

[SSJ2]

Chapter: 257 (DBZ 63), P10.1-2
Context: Vegeta bragging to Dodoria about how he became stronger.
Vegeta: “Fuhahaha…! We Saiyans grow stronger each time we fight…! The stronger the opponent, the stronger we become…So I’m becoming stronger too…! I almost died on Earth, and have now vastly powered up…!”


Can this be retroactively applied to any of Goku's tough battles, even excluding fights that didn't bring him to near death? For example after the 21st Budokai when he was tested to his limit but not near death.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

That definitely seems to be the case when Kuririn attributes Kid Goku's gains to Vegeta's explanation of Zenkais and there were at best 3-4 battles that could've been described as near death ones (2 of which Kuririn wouldn't really be able to accurately consider on account of dying and not seeing him for 3 years). The part about them getting stronger when faced with a strong opponent though would suggest it only mainly applies to the cases where an opponent's strength was practically equal to his own, particularly when this gimmick seemed virtually non-existent after the Freeza Arc until spinoffs like GT and Super pushed it to the Nth degree.

 

[SSJ2]

How literally can the statement be taken? I agree that it should only be applicable in cases where the opponent was a near equal, but how intense would the battle need to be to see gains? Goku vs Son Gohan is an example where they were near equal but the battle wasn't all that intense, nor did it last long. Would that result in a gain in power?

 

[Captain Cadaver]

Probably not, especially when Goku seemed to have a fair lead in raw strength. I'd mainly just factor in the battles in which Goku was left too fatigued to stand after them such as against Jackie Chun, after Muscle Tower, etc. considering Vegeta's wording when making a similar comment to Zarbon suggests he was exaggerating a bit against Dodoria; particularly with Kuririn specifies the times Goku had a fierce fight rather than just a general one.

 

[ahill1]

Yeah, Namu was also fairly close to Goku and their battle was fairly even, but I don't qualify that battle as 'fierce' enough for Goku to have squeezed some gains. Against Jackie Chun, sure, but not heavy gains. Kuririn also saw how Goku grew stronger from the time Goku battled Jackie to his fight against General Blue, so he may have assumed Goku went through some fierce battles and gained power that way. I think Vegeta was kinda exaggerating with the "each time we fight", then. It's not every pun battle that will direct any gain, otherwise it'd be more thoughtfully noted.

 

[GreatSaiyaman123]

I always assumed Goku’s got stronger after the Budokai. His fight with Jackie was a pretty good workout.

Talking about zenkais in part 1, did Goku get stronger after his beatdowns in the hands of Tao and Piccolo? Those are the two occasions he was left near death in the series.

 

[SSJ2]

Probably, though there's no point of making note of either of them when Goku became dramatically stronger from training directly after.

 

[GreatSaiyaman123]

I think that changes a lot. Goku got the zenkai from Tao’s beating and then got many times stronger with Karin. So Goku ought to have grown way more than the minimum 3x we use.

Same with the Choushinsui if we take the Oozaru imagery as an indication. Zenkai and then the 10x boost.

 

[SSJ2]

Zenkais aren't shown to be nearly as significant in part 1 though. It would be a minimal increase at best. They seem to become exponentially greater the more powerful/closer to Super Saiyan you become.

 

[Diamond Ryan]

How much stronger do you think Goku got after the 22nd Budokai? Did he get a zenkai from Tambourine?

 

[Future Warrior]

I think it's a given they get stronger, even if it's not by a lot. Battle experience, adaptability, ect.

Hell, just read the latest DBS chapter and it's pretty much told to us, at least as far as what Toyotaro thinks of the matter.

 

[SSJ2]

How much stronger do you think Goku got after the 22nd Budokai? Did he get a zenkai from Tambourine?

Maybe a similar gain to what he had post 21st. I think the bulk of the gains came from the zenkais at Muscle Tower and from Tambourine.

 

[GreatSaiyaman123]

How much stronger do you think Goku got after the 22nd Budokai? Did he get a zenkai from Tambourine?

It probably was the most noteworthy Zenkai since he had the fights with Tenshinhan and Tambourine. I have it comparable to Vegeta’s first Zenkai post Earth.

 

[Hector]

I don't think that zenkais and getting stronger after tough battles are two separate things. A near death experience is the ultimate form of a tough battle, so it wields the greatest boost.

 

[ahill1]

In the new chapter of Super, Veget states he was getting stronger as the fight against Granola went on. Does that change something? He wasn't near death there.

 

[SSJ2]

If that was the case in the original manga, Goku would have come out on top of every close battle he was in, and quite easily. He was already ahead of Tenshinhan in the 22nd Budokai. If he was getting stronger during the match he should've won with ease.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

In the new chapter of Super, Veget states he was getting stronger as the fight against Granola went on. Does that change something? He wasn't near death there.

It just shows that Super takes Vegeta's statement overly literally and cranks its usage up to 11, since constant power ups in battle would've obviously led to Goku crushing any comparable opponent if so as SSJ2 said. Vegeta's gains against Granolah could at best be explained through God Ki and greater experience far increasing how far he can take his Saiyan traits (which is basically just me rewriting it to make even the slightest semblance of sense) and at worst a plot hole.