SSj Goku (Cell-Games) vs Blow-Jack

[Fantastische Hure]

Gohan said Goku's power was amazing or incredible something, just that he expected him to be higher than him. He himself stated this. You are twisting statements now.

 

[Pakl]

What common logic?? The comkon logic is clearly with me. I have shown all the evidence through years not to mention its common sense what I have been saying. I dont get how some of you cant see it. Its freaking obvious

I dont know how Base Coola being in par with 100% Freeza (which is nonsense) has anything about what me and CC are arguing, Tapion

To debunk this ridiculous Base Goku being .

Goku was like "OH SHIT he is EVEN stronger than Freeza" after Coola transformed. Why being so shocked if his base form was anyway stronger and Coola could actually spar with him? Goku had to use Kaioken x20 to fight Coola who is EVEN stronger than Freeza and got his ass kicked. Only as a SSjin Goku beats him and Coola then said he sees why Freeza lost.

Not to mention new movie villians being stronger than the last onea already make it more obvious as M6 SSjin Vegeta who is the same as the one who fought 19 is clearly not 100x Freeza and he is way ahead of M5 Goku

DEBUNKED

Oh and SHC, if your only counter to my post is that Base Bojack never fought Gohan, then you lost your credibillity

As for Gohan saying Bojack is amazing, SHC, I admitted its not a solid thing. However he never commented on the henchmen too. Just saying. Anyway treat to the other solid points I made. Lol

 

[Captain Cadaver]

unless you want to say Goku was weaker than Piccolo.

That could be a genuine possibility though. Piccolo has shown himself to be capable of making huge gains if the plot requires it (implications of his power after Kaio's training, getting to SSJ tier after 3 years training with Goku, etc.) and Goku was portrayed as having definitely gained a Zenkai in the film.

Goku (Post-Zenkai) >> Piccolo > Initial Goku is possible for Movie 5.

They didnt nerf Gohan. If anything, Gohan at first looks less impressive because he didnt want to fight but later got mad. Again the same as the CG. Thats the movies basis after all

Which would make no sense when the entire point of his character arc in the Cell Games was to not shy away from battle and protect his loved ones from those that would harm them. Even Toei aren't inconsistent enough to make such a huge character regression.

Okay, a KHH of Goku would obviously do a serious damage to Bojack of he stands there and take it head on. That doesnt prove anything about Bojack still being comparable to M9/CG Gohan and the Cell who fought him

It proves that Goku still has a chance of winning through it. Base Bojack being superior to Goku would mean little if Goku can possibly still win through an amplified attack.

I fail to see your reason about Tullece. So what if he was a saiyan

Then you fail to understand that character and narrative are far more important as objective comparison than something as purely a fan concern as how powerful a character is in one medium compared to another from an opposing one.

 

[Fantastische Hure]

He's saying 4th form Cooler was around Freeza's power.

Blow-Jack never fighting Gohan was meant to counter your point of saying that Blow-Jack was for some reason supposed to be on-par with surpressed Cell. He didn't even fight Gohan in his normal form like Cell did.

 

[Pakl]

unless you want to say Goku was weaker than Piccolo.

That could be a genuine possibility though. Piccolo has shown himself to be capable of making huge gains if the plot requires it (implications of his power after Kaio's training, getting to SSJ tier after 3 years training with Goku, etc.) and Goku was portrayed as having definitely gained a Zenkai in the film.

Goku (Post-Zenkai) >> Piccolo > Initial Goku is possible for Movie 5.

They didnt nerf Gohan. If anything, Gohan at first looks less impressive because he didnt want to fight but later got mad. Again the same as the CG. Thats the movies basis after all

Which would make no sense when the entire point of his character arc in the Cell Games was to not shy away from battle and protect his loved ones from those that would harm them. Even Toei aren't inconsistent enough to make such a huge character regression.

Okay, a KHH of Goku would obviously do a serious damage to Bojack of he stands there and take it head on. That doesnt prove anything about Bojack still being comparable to M9/CG Gohan and the Cell who fought him

It proves that Goku still has a chance of winning through it. Base Bojack being superior to Goku would mean little if Goku can possibly still win through an amplified attack.

I fail to see your reason about Tullece. So what if he was a saiyan

Then you fail to understand that character and narrative are far more important as objective comparison than something as purely a fan concern as how powerful a character is in one medium compared to another from an opposing one.

Haha come on CC, Thats just looking at things too deep. Goku having troubles in the beginning is to show the henchmens strength at first as a threat. Again to build up drama. The same aa in movie 9 as Goham having troubles in the beginning and later can beat them until Bojack kicked him oit of SSjin. Not that Piccolo is stronger. Dont be ridiculous here. While I agree Goku got some zenkai, its never stated or anything.

What are you talking about? When Gohan first fought Cell, he later didnt want to fight him which is why Cell made the Cell Jrs plan.

Ughh ok, Base Bojack clearly cant tank Gokus IT KHH, at least not canon wise. So what? We are arguing over Base Bojacks strength.

Tullece being a saiyan is not because he is based on Vegeta from the Saiyan arc but because TOEI chose to make such a charactrr. Not to mention he can be based on Namek arc Vegeta too if you want to look at him that way. Doesnt change the fact that M2 is based on late Saiyan Arc and M3 ia based on Namek arc.

Slug was a Namekian, yet he was not based on Piccolo Daimao in terms of strength. You tend to complicate things and get into new arguments which are off topic and irrelevant.

 

[Pakl]

He's saying 4th form Cooler was around Freeza's power.

Blow-Jack never fighting Gohan was meant to counter your point of saying that Blow-Jack was for some reason supposed to be on-par with surpressed Cell. He didn't even fight Gohan in his normal form like Cell did.

4rth form Coola vs Base Goku is based on initial 4rth form Freeza vs Base Goku. Ok and? Baae Bojack not being still in par with the Cell who fought Goku and Gohan because he never fought Gohan in movie 9 is a logic failure

Bojack is based on Cell in the CG. The only states Cell shows in the CG as Perfect which logically fit Bojack is his suppressed state vs Goku and Gohan and his FP

Hence Base Bojack ~ Suppressed Perfect Cell vs Goku and Gohan
FP Bojack ~ FP Perfect Cell

I dont understand why you disagree too much when its the normal Nd common sense ans also fits bases on everything

 

[Fantastische Hure]

How is it a "logic failure"? You claim just because it's based on the Cell Saga that Blow-Jack has the same power as surpressed Cell but that doesn't work when he never fights Gohan or Goku like Cell does. Toei doesn't give a fack about surpressed powers or all that stuff you are talking about they don't look into it.

If Blow-Jack was on-par with Goku at-least he'd get a decent power-up in full-power because he is not Cell level.

 

[Fantastische Hure]

Besides how do you explain M10? The ending tried to copy Gohan vs Cell KHH struggle according to you but Broly is higher according to the creator.

 

[Pakl]

How is it a "logic failure"? You claim just because it's based on the Cell Saga that Blow-Jack has the same power as surpressed Cell but that doesn't work when he never fights Gohan or Goku like Cell does. Toei doesn't give a fack about surpressed powers or all that stuff you are talking about they don't look into it.

If Blow-Jack was on-par with Goku at-least he'd get a decent power-up in full-power because he is not Cell level.

And when exactly did I say a movie villian has to fight a specific character? Toei doesnt care about a suppressed character? Look, M9 is based on CG. Its not rocket science to assume thay Base Bojack os in par with Cell who fought Goku and Gohan and his full power is in par with FP Cell.. Seeing as how movie villians have a counterpart in the series a lot of time, its common sense and its also baaed on feats and nothing contradicts it

SHC, you seem to argue for the sake of argue lol

So you yourself basicaly said that Base Bojack must be stronger than Goku? If Bojack got a decent power up and still below FP Cell then... Sorry, I dont get your last sentence. Bojack did get much stronger and was implied to be really tough as said in the Daizenshuu but you ignore it


DBZF agaenda was always Bojack nerfing amd Broli wanking

 

[Fantastische Hure]

I said Blow-Jack is not FP Cell level. He isn't that much higher than SSJ Gohan. If he's only Goku level in his normal state and then powers-up to a-bit above Gohan, at-least he gets a good power-up.

Blow-Jack also got no big power-up scene like Cell did in the anime. He just powered-up and that was it.

 

[Pakl]

Besides how do you explain M10? The ending tried to copy Gohan vs Cell KHH struggle according to you but Broly is higher accords to the creator.

Movie 10 doesnt have a basis in the anime because its based on the arc where there was no real fight nor someone stronger than before.

I also keep failling to see your point. How does that have to do with Bojack being a clear counterpart to Cell? Not everything has to be the same. Especially movie 10 as I explained above why.

M9 is just like all the movies in terms of how they relate to the anime

 

[Fantastische Hure]

"Not everything has to be the same" when it fits your narrative. Disregard anything that doesn't go with your logic, right?!

Goku's spirit appearing and helping Gohan in a beam-struggle doesn't remind you of anything?

 

[Pakl]

I said Blow-Jack is not FP Cell level. He isn't that much higher than SSJ Gohan. If he's only Goku level in his normal state and then powers-up to a-bit above Gohan, at-least he gets a good power-up.

Blow-Jack also got no big power-up scene like Cell did in the anime. He just powered-up and that was it.

Base Bojack should be in par witb SSjin Gohan not SSjin Goku.

Bojack is much stronger than Gohan. I proved it countless of times. He was toying with him. He kicked him out of SSjin and was able to actually survive SSjin 2 Gohan as he cancelled out his KHH. Someone not much stronger than Gohan would never do it. The Daizenshuu also impliea Gohan was much stronger. Bojack is clearly FP PC counterpart as its based on it.

Also him not having a huge power up like Cell means nothing. Its a movie we are talking about. He is also said to power up a lot in the Daizenshuu

Base Bojack being barley around SSjin Goku is lol worthy especially when M9 is based on the CG and Gohan who ia stronger than Goku is the main hero

 

[Pakl]

"Not everything has to be the same" when it fits your narrative. Disregard anything that doesn't go with your logic, right?!

Goku's spirit appearing and helping Gohan in a beam-struggle doesn't remind you of anything?

OK they copied it from Gohan vs Cell obviously but again, thats because there was no progression during M10 time line and nothing new during the beginning of the Boo arc so again using movie 10 is indeed logic failure because all the movies before show the same pattern plus 12 and 13.

 

[Fantastische Hure]

You say it's a movie and that's why Blow-Jack didn't get a power-up scene, yet whenever you talk about Broly you say because Broly powers-up like Goku he is 50% Goku level, so why didn't Blow-Jack get a power-up scene like Cell did if Broly did for his counter-part?

He didn't cancel-out Gohan's KHH l0l. Gohan didn't even try. Gohan punched a hole through Blow-Jack.

Blow-Jack knocked Gohan out of SSJ after he was already tired.

 

[Pakl]

You say it's a movie and that's why Blow-Jack didn't get a power-up scene, yet whenever you talk about Broly you say because Broly powers-up like Goku he is 50% Goku level, so why didn't Blow-Jack get a power-up scene like Cell did if Broly did for his counter-part?

He didn't cancel-out Gohan's KHH l0l. Gohan didn't even try. Gohan punched a hole through Blow-Jack.

Blow-Jack knocked Gohan out of SSJ after he was already tired.

But wait, Brolis transformation is clearly based on Cell when he went perfect too in terms of appearance and such. Thats undeniable and once again, why cant you differ between those cases?? Cells power up was massive and dragged out in the anime so we will think he can do anything to Gohan. Gohan went SSjin 2 vs Cell before the latter powered up. Gohan went SSjin 2 vs Bojack before the latter powered up. Big difference and besides, its a movie. You ignore the obvious basis of the movie and mentions other things just to try to disprove it which is why I aaid its a logic failure

Thata like me trying to argue Gohan was SSjin 2 va Dabura because Grade 3 Trunks had lightning so they mean nothing.

And again, not every little detail has to be copy pasted

Your argument about the power up to deny FP Bojack and FP Cell to be counterparts is like saying that because Slugs henchmen got killed not like the Ginyu force, that they are not their clear counterparts.

 

[Fantastische Hure]

Actually SSJ2 Gohan came after Blow-Jack powered-up.

 

[Pakl]

Actually SSJ2 Gohan came after Blow-Jack powered-up.

Thats what I said no? Against Bojack, it was after and against Cell it was before. Thats the difference. Freeza reaching 100% took a looonggg time but Coolas transformation took him seconds. The movies are short so they have shorter fights and power ups than the series

Edit: I meant to say after about Bojack. Typo sorry

 

[Fantastische Hure]

But apparently Broly got a some-what elaborate power-up scene. I wonder...

 

[Fantastische Hure]

And Lord Slug's hench-meng's clearly are not Ginyu-Force counter-parts l0l. They are just random hench-meng. They don't even have anything in common besides getting owned by Goku.