SSJ2 Vegeta (Buu Arc) vs SSJ2 Gohan (Cell Games)

[SSJ2]

It seemed more to me like he was banking on Gohan getting weaker, rather than having surpassed him himself.

Chapter: 426 (DBZ 232), P4.2-3
Context: Vegeta talks to Gohan
Vegeta: “At that time there was a large gap between our powers…But what about now? While you’ve been enjoying peace, I’ve continued to train.”

Chapter: 423 (DBZ 229), P4.1
Vegeta: “Your body’s gotten rusty. No matter how peaceful it may be, you should still train just in case.”

 

[p123]

Yes initially he said that. Then once he realized that Gohan was only that strong because of his enraged power, he assumed he would win easily... Lol

 

[SSJ2]

I think it depends on how you view the Cell Games then. I don't see there being a rage boost on top of SSJ2.

 

[Six Trails]

Vegeta after getting his Majin boost barely surpassed Kid Gohan, so I don't really see how he could be stronger before it.

 

[p123]

Well we know that a rage boost and Super Saiyan 2 are not one in the same.

Vegeta, Goku and Kaioshin all make comments suggesting that Super Saiyan 2 and Enraged Gohan are two different levels. Why don't you accept facts you fucking white male?

 

[Six Trails]

I don't think there's a fixed rage boost, that doesn't make much sense really. Gohan getting angry just means him getting stronger, and I think his SS2 is lumped in that group for the most part.

 

[SSJ2]

Yeah, but it makes more sense imo if Gohan wasn't enraged during the Cell Games. Vegeta was like "you never know what will happen if he were to snap into a frenzy", and Goku said "you can beat anyone if you get mad". Wouldn't they know what enraged Gohan is capable of if he was enraged during the Cell Games? Especially considering he was stronger there in his own right.

 

[p123]

Yea, there isn't a fixed rage boost. I don't know why you brought that up.

Exactly. Vegeta is uberly confident against fighting Gohan, but an enraged Gohan gives him pause.

Goku talks about how weak Gohan is, but tells him if he gets mad like he did against Cell, no one could beat him. Even when shown that Vegeta and Goku were much stronger than himself.

Ladies and gentlemen, we have a rage boost.

 

[Six Trails]

Gohan has always had rage boosts, ever since the Saiyan arc. It's not some new discovery or anything, and nobody is denying it. I'm only arguing that I don't think there was some extra boost on top of his SS2 at the Cell Games.

 

[p123]

Then why did Goku tell Gohan he could beat ANYONE if he got mad like he did against Cell, whereas, at the Budokai, no one would say that about Gohan's Super Saiyan 2 power? It was scoffed at and mocked.

 

[Six Trails]

Again, I'm only arguing that Gohan didn't get some extra boost at the Cell Games. I'm not arguing that he couldn't in the Boo arc.

 

[p123]

Goku's quote implies he did get one at the Cell Games though. Did you read my last post?

 

[Tapion]

I agree with Mike here. It's made clear on the Cell Games that Gohan's Super Saiyan 2 is his rage boost, but it could've changed on the Boo Saga.

 

[p123]

You can't have Super Saiyan 2 as his rage boost. Here are the options.

1) His rage unlocked Super Saiyan 2, not rage boost, just anger unlocking a new form like Goku did on Namek.
2) His rage boost increased his power on top of unlocking a new transformation.

It's either one of the other.

 

[Tapion]

All the characters on the Cell Games, even Perfect Cell, agree with Gohan's Super Saiyan 2 being his enraged state.

 

[Six Trails]

Goku's quote implies he did get one at the Cell Games though. Did you read my last post?

Yes, I did read your last post. I consider Super Saiyan 2 and rage boosts to be in the same group, since when Gohan first became a Super Saiyan 2 it was because of his rage. I don't think Goku's quote has to mean "get angry and get the same boost from your rage than you did against Cell".

 

[p123]

They are not. That's what you are misunderstanding.

The goal was never to get Gohan angry enough to unlock a new form, the plan was always to get Gohan angry enough to unleash his true dormant power.

It's not a static boost, it is merely unleashing everything he has.

 

[Six Trails]

They are not. That's what you are misunderstanding.

There is no misunderstanding. I just interpret it differently than you do.

The goal was never to get Gohan angry enough to unlock a new form, the plan was always to get Gohan angry enough to unleash his true dormant power.

Which, for me, was just his Super Saiyan 2 at the Cell Games. I just think his potential grew larger by the time of the Boo arc. I think that's at least feasible, don't you?

It's not a static boost, it is merely unleashing everything he has.

I know it's not a static boost. I already said that earlier.

 

[p123]

So are you saying that Goku's Super Saiyan on Namek was a rage boost as well? What's the difference between that and what Gohan did?

 

[ahill1]

I see it as Goku, Vegeta and Gohan having different views of this latter's enranged powers. Vegeta goes more on the unpredictability of Gohan's rage (after all, he saw him having different kinds of boost through the Saiyan and Freeza saga). Gohan I see underestimating a bit his enranged powers. He thinks that with his true power he'd only be able to manage something against initial fat Boo, whereas Goku knows his dormant power grew along with his age, so it would be able to let Gohan stronger than everyone.

SSJ2 =/= "rage boost" in the Boo saga, where Gohan can stack some power on top of it. I don't think it HAS to be that way in the Cell Game.