Super Saiyan God SS

[Ssj3Gogeta96]

Well...

"It's a little complicated and hard to explain, but basically, it's the Super Saiyan form of a Saiyan who has the power of Super Saiyan God." - Dragon Teams rendition of the explanation.

Take from that what you want. Doesn't sound like he can turn regular ssj anymore going by that alone. But goku and vegeta in base forms have normal ki right? Not sure but if that's true, then if they turn ssj with normal ki it should result in a normal ssj. When they tap into their ssjg power, it's ssj blue. That's what I'm thinking

 

[SSJ2]

See, I don't take that quote to mean that this form has to be stronger than the original SSJG form. I'm reading it like, "this is what super saiyan turns into after completing the god ritual", I don't see that as having to mean that it is superior to its predecessor.

 

[Ssj3Gogeta96]

Exactly. I guess you could it's just say it's ssj being fueled by ssjg. I think it might've been said somewhere that it's stronger than ssjg so it results in a stronger more stable form. Although probably not much stronger since they're still weaker than beerus

 

[SSJ2]

In FnF it's stated that the two of them could fight Beerus well with teamwork. Following AT's numbers:

Beerus: 10
SSJG Goku: 6

Going back to the Freeza arc, Freeza says that Dodoria and Zarbon can beat Vegeta if they team up. So two fighters at 85-87% of one fighter can take the single fighter down. Whis never says that they can beat him, but fight Beerus evenly, so let's scale that back to about 80% to evenly fight. That would leave SSJB Goku and Vegeta at around an 8 to Beerus' 10, giving it a measly 1.33x boost of SSJG.

You follow?

That means Gold Freeza would be about a 9.2 IMO given the fight against Goku. Does that make sense? Should Gold Freeza be that close to Beerus?

 

[Ssj3Gogeta96]

Sounds about right. Don't forget Frieza isn't a god so he was scared shitless based on reputation. If goku is an 8, friezas a 9, and beerus is a 10 everything works I think

 

[Six Trails]

Was Gold Freeza vs. SSGSS Goku that one-sided? I don't recall, but it was definitely closer than Base Goku vs. 4th form Freeza, right?

How does this work:

Beers: 10
Gold: 8.3333333
Goku/Vegeta: 8

?

 

[Ssj3Gogeta96]

What about 8, 8.8, and 10?

 

[Six Trails]

I suppose. I'm aware Freeza's fear of Beers was based off reputation, but at the same time I feel the intent is to show Freeza is still a good chunk below Beers. Is Freeza at 8.3 too close to Goku?

 

[SSJ2]

Was Gold Freeza vs. SSGSS Goku that one-sided? I don't recall, but it was definitely closer than Base Goku vs. 4th form Freeza, right?

How does this work:

Beers: 10
Gold: 8.3333333
Goku/Vegeta: 8

?

Goku was getting in hits but doing 0 damage to Freeza. The mid-later portion of the battle was just Goku getting stomped. I think it's a big gap.

Plus needing teamwork to win is an 85-87% gap in my book.

 

[Ssj3Gogeta96]

I'm trying to figure this out

If base goku post God is 50x weaker than ssjg then turns ssjb and gets a little stronger than ssjg, then wouldn't a normal ssj2 and 3 be stronger?

 

[SSJ2]

Maybe he can't turn into those forms with God power.

 

[Ssj3Gogeta96]

Makes sense. I guess no more gold haired ssj anymore?

 

[Six Trails]

Unless it's from Gohan, Goten, or Trunks (or Satan), I guess not. I don't really mind though, I like the blue look.

 

[SSJ2]

I just don't get what the point of it is. The explanations have been so godawful that we literally have no idea as to why/how the form even came to be.

 

[Papasmurf]

Toriyama basically claimed in an interview after BOG that Goku would now try to focus on mastering Super Saiyan to a point where it would overshadow ssj2/ssj3, but knowing him he's probably forgotten saying that already. (Not to mention that's a copypasta of the Cell Games concept)

 

[Ssj3Gogeta96]

I never understood why he said that. It's not really a good reason to not go ssj2/3

 

[Papasmurf]

He claimed that Super Saiyan 2/3 drain too much power so mastering ssj would provide a greater increase and sap less strength. I would assume they don't multi-fold your power like they used to, otherwise there's no sense in dropping Super Saiyan 2 (which isn't even that draining). But as I said, this is the current Toriyama we're talking about here. Could say some weird asspulled shit the next time he's interviewed.

 

[Ssj3Gogeta96]

To be fair we never saw enough of ssj2 to see how much it really drains. 90% of the majin vegeta vs goku fight was filler

 

[Papasmurf]

Well, we know how much it saps compared to Super Saiyan 1 in the regard that Goku didn't use it until he wanted to quickly defeat Vegeta, and that unlike SSJ grades 2 and 3 it was never discarded for the power drain. Gohan also showed no trouble sustaining the form immediately after achieving it, whereas Goku commented how the grade forms were useless partially due to the aggravated strain issues and was breathing heavily after only standing around in grade 3 for a short while to explain it. All in all the form's drain doesn't appear to be a whole lot, especially since Gohan lost over half his ki in the Cell arc and still didn't lose the form, and so did Majin Vegeta after being injured by Boo.

 

[Ssj3Gogeta96]

True good points. Yeah doesn't make sense. If there isn't much more drain than ssj1 the power increase should be worth it