Ultimate Gohan was flabbergasted by Oob/Pure Boo

[kriss-]

The only notable change that Akira Toriyama presented was that Gohan had become a scholar, other-wise, he is still completely the same.

Chapter: 519 (DBZ 325), P10.6
Context: as Goku and Oob fight
Kuririn: “Yo-you’re kidding…!?”
Gohan: “Wh-what is that kid…!?”

There wouldn't be a reason for Gohan to be nearly at a loss for words if he was that much stronger than either Goku or the reincarnated Pure Boo. Gohan is actually stuttering because he is so impressed.

IMO, the common norm just doesn't make any sense.

 

[sei'taer]

Yeah there's no way he's astounded because some random kid is equal to goku. Clearly he's amazed by the kids power compared to his own.

 

[kriss-]

There wouldn't be a reason for him to be impressed with something that he is so much greater than. He's done this when he was watching Goku fighting Cell during the Cell Games, everybody was astounded but he wasn't. So his characteristic traits suggests that he wouldn't be impressed with someone unless they surpass his own capabilities.

 

[Fantastische Hure]

@Saylé talks so much about twisting statements to fit their own narrative, but please look at this irony, gais.

 

[kriss-]

@Saylé talks so much about twisting statements to fit their own narrative, but please look at this irony, gais.

@Uchiha

Completely unnecessary response and it adds essentially nothing to the present discussion.

 

[Fantastische Hure]

@Saylé talks so much about twisting statements to fit their own narrative, but please look at this irony, gais.

@Uchiha

Completely unnecessary response and it adds essentially nothing to the present discussion.

It's not that hard to see, you clearly are just twisting the statement to fit your narrative.

In the Goten & Trunks vs Dabura thread, you said Goten isn't that close to Gohan because Gohan was just surprised that they were children and so power-ful and that catching-up to him soon could mean anything, yet here look how you're twisting this statement please. It's a joke.

 

[Tapion]

You don't see random and unknown kids fighting evenly with a powerful and capable warrior like Goku everyday, do you? That's why he is flabbergasted. He didn't expect an unknown random kid to fight evenly with his father. Even if Gohan is stronger than Goku, he still admires his father as an warrior.

 

[kriss-]

The two examples are essentially the exact same thing. Gohan is watching someone fight his father. If Gohan felt unimpressed with either fighter he wouldn't have said anything to begin with. My argument makes sense whether you're arguing that Gohan is comparing them to himself or comparing them to his father, because it falls under the logic that Gohan would undermine Oob or Goku if he felt that he was vastly superior to either of them, as he did during the Cell Games.

 

[Evil Vegeta]

Oob is an unknown, which makes it vastly different in comparison. Cell Games Gohan wanted to believe Goku was stronger than him, whereas that no longer matters to a Gohan that's since went on to become a scholar. Only Vegeta knew about Oob (though he doesn't appear to know about him during the End of Z), so Gohan's reaction makes sense from that standpoint. The guy wasn't even fighting anymore. Not like we know how strong Gohan is at this point, anyway.

 

[kriss-]

Goku's full capabilities were an unknown as well, as were Perfect Cells. Yet Gohan didn't feel compelled to say he was impressed with them until he actually saw them fight. He only ever stated that he's unimpressed with someone when he knows that he's superior, the display of Oob and Goku was still impressive enough for him to state so because Goku was the foundation of power with which it took for him to make such a statement. Dragonball Super Gohan has went back to training so it doesn't really matter if someone argues that Gohan stopped training; this is contradicted by Akira Toriyama's introductory artwork above, which doesn't imply anything to that degree.

Furthermore, he's stuttering because he is so impressed, he can't even speak properly. This implies a tremendous difference.

 

[Tapion]

The two examples are essentially the exact same thing. Gohan is watching someone fight his father

His father is the same guy that Gohan admires due to his will of fighting and capability. Seeing a completely random and unknown kid that was supposed to have a power of 3 at best fighting evenly with him would certainly shock Gohan.

f Gohan felt unimpressed with either fighter he wouldn't have said anything to begin with

Conjecture with no proof. You say that our posts are "fan speculation" but you don't watch yourself, huh?
Little analogy -> If you see a random, unknown kid fighting evenly with a experencied and famous mma fighter that you admire, wouldn't you be shocked as well?

my argument makes sense whether you're arguing that Gohan is comparing them to himself or comparing them to his father, because it falls under the logic that Gohan would undermine Oob or Goku if he felt that he was vastly superior to either of them, as he did during the Cell Games.

The first part is conjecture, the second part i respond with: Kid Gohan = \ = Adult Gohan. Their personality aren't comparable because one is a kid, and the other is an adult.

 

[kriss-]

His father is the same guy that Gohan admires due to his will of fighting and capability. Seeing a completely random and unknown kid that was supposed to have a power of 3 at best fighting evenly with him would certainly shock Gohan.

Gohan was simply unimpressed with Goku, he expected to see more, but he didn't. Simultaneously, this would occur with someone Goku is fighting as well, but it doesn't.

Conjecture with no proof. You say that our posts are "fan speculation" but you don't watch yourself, huh?
Little analogy -> If you see a random, unknown kid fighting evenly with a experencied and famous mma fighter that you admire, wouldn't you be shocked as well?

Gohan felt unimpressed with Goku and had to say something. Gohan felt impressed with Oob and had to say something, do you not see the connecting point here? He wouldn't suggest something unless he was either: a) Impressed and felt himself inferior or b) Impressed and felt that he was superior.

Whether it's his biological father or an unknown enemy doesn't make a difference.

The first part is conjecture, the second part i respond with: Kid Gohan = \ = Adult Gohan. Their personality aren't comparable because one is a kid, and the other is an adult.

They are the same character.

Please use the word conjecture properly.

 

[Evil Vegeta]

Goku's full capabilities were an unknown as well, as were Perfect Cells. Yet Gohan didn't feel compelled to say he was impressed with them until he actually saw them fight. He only ever stated that he's unimpressed with someone when he knows that he's superior, the display of Oob and Goku was still impressive enough for him to state so because Goku was the foundation of power with which it took for him to make such a statement.

That's not the point of the scene. Gohan was under the assumption that Goku was holding-back and was shown to be completely wrong despite wanting to believe the opposite. Just because a nine yr old reacted a certain way doesn't mean that needs to carry over to him nearly twenty yrs later. Gohan was even shown to be baffled by Goten's throwing ability, but we know for a fact he wasn't weaker.

Dragonball Super Gohan has went back to training so it doesn't really matter if someone argues that Gohan stopped training; this is contradicted by Akira Toriyama's introductory artwork above, which doesn't imply anything to that degree.

DB Super Goku also stomps on any Boo level being, so I'm not sure how you're helping yourself when using that.

Furthermore, he's stuttering because he is so impressed, he can't even speak properly. This implies a tremendous difference.

In your opinion. I saw no stuttering from Gohan when Gotenks Boo appeared. These characters don't react the same way over every instance.

 

[kriss-]

That's not the point of the scene. Gohan was under the assumption that Goku was holding-back and was shown to be completely wrong despite wanting to believe the opposite. Just because a nine yr old reacted a certain way doesn't mean that needs to carry over to him nearly twenty yrs later. Gohan was even shown to be baffled by Goten's throwing ability, but we know for a fact he wasn't weaker.

It surely does, his character wouldn't change.

DB Super Goku also stomps on any Boo level being, so I'm not sure how you're helping yourself when using that.

It means that you can't argue that Gohan's lack of training would actually matter.

In your opinion. I saw no stuttering from Gohan when Gotenks Boo appeared. These characters don't react the same way over every instance.

What Herms has told us informs us that he is clearly stuttering from how powerful Oob is.

 

[Tapion]

Gohan is not visibly impressed with Goku, but it is directly stated that he admires his father's will and abilities as a warrior. To see a random kid fighting him toe to toe is absurd even if Gohan is stronger.

Kid Gohan and Adult Gohan are the same character, but their personalities aren't the same. While Kid Gohan as a SSj is more like a kid, Adult Gohan is an adult and has an adult personality.

The word conjecture means an hypothesis, so i'm using it properly.

 

[kriss-]

He would state his superiority or inferiority if it was relevant, he always does. Arguing otherwise makes little to no sense.

 

[Evil Vegeta]

Gohan didn't shudder while standing in front of Gotenks Boo.

Does this mean there wasn't a huge difference? Nope. Does this mean characters are allowed to behave differently depending on the situation? Of course.

Super Goku shits on any Majin Boo level being, btw.

 

[kriss-]

Gohan is stuttering because of Oobs capabilities, he's obviously impressed with something. Characters always stutter at some point when a power is depicted as being greater than there own. Akira Toriyama wouldn't have made a comparison unless he was trying to tell us something.

Super Gokus base transformation doesn't shit on Pure Boo level beings.

 

[Evil Vegeta]

Considering it's well beyond Super Saiyan 3, it does. Goku absorbed the power and got way stronger because of it. Super Saiyan 3 was trash to Beers at best.

Beers said both Goku and Vegeta were way stronger after Whis' training and challenged them to a fight. There's nothing implying they didn't eclipse their previous levels.

 

[kriss-]

Goku Super Saiyan God is implied to be trash according to new evidence. Beerus could have one-shotted him the entire time. It's no longer a relevant argument.

Goku and Vegeta could have improved tremendously over their Base forms, but it doesn't mean anything, nor does it mean they are a challenge to Beerus, because the much stronger Goku Super Saiyan Blue (Kaio-Kenx10) isn't.