When Goku takes off to train Oob...
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Way farther. Even to Freeza he said he should train and get better if he wanted to challenge him again. I think Goku expects a fully trained Oob to surpass SSJ3 EoZ Gotenks or Ultimate Gohan at least, since he thinks Oob will be his best challenger.
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Going by manga logic do you think Oob can surpass SSJ/SSJ2/SSJ3 Vegetto (Boo saga)?
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I think he can reach Super Boo level but no farther than that.
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Shouldn't Oob have more potential than Gohan? Gohan's starting power even while enraged was only 1307 and future Gohan wasn't even Yardrat Goku level after training for over a decade. Oob surpasses that at age 10 by a mile. Even Ultimate Goku might be Super Boo level lol.
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At least when Goku is taking off with Oob, he shouts "we'll get even stronger!!'. Maybe stronger in the sense Oob will learn how to use his power effectively, but yeah, it likely he'll push him way beyond that.
If Oob already conformed to Goku's expectations in the tournament, where he said someone besides us and Boo "might" win, and he can already fend off that level in base... Then merely pushing Oob to use that power effectively wouldn't be a challenge to Goku's highest states. There's that theory of mine Goku stacked the SSJs power in base, but that's just headcanon.
Goku sees how Oob can't even fly and says he has never had a master... Similar to Gohan stating to Goten "what about doing things in order"... And Oob also reminds Kid Gohan vs Raditz a little bit. Piccolo stated Gohan had amazing power but couldn't bring that power at will, so he'd train him to effectively use his power. He had displayed a 1307 BP Vs Raditz, and that number sounds like a good estimation more or less to his BP Vs Vegeta and Nappa, so all in all Piccolo made him capable of bringing that power more naturally... But kid Gohan could get way stronger as time went on, so yeah, naturally should Oob too.
The problem though is that Gohan's potential is way bigger than Goku's... If Oob has already a huge starting point like that, being Boo's reincarnation, it wouldn't be a stretch to think he'd have way more potential than Gohan. How can Goku expect to have an all out battle against someone whose potential would exceed his hugely? Not taking Super into account, were Goku to bring out Oob's potential assuming he has way more than even Gohan, Goku wouldn't hope to compete to that... So maybe Oob's max is limited to what Kid Boo displayed? Or dunno, maybe his maximum would be Super Boo/Buff Boo at most, but that's a little more random to think because he's the reincarnation of Boo alone, Pure Boo, not Boo who has merged with Godly beings. Super implies Oob has godly powers tho, but that's straight up BS imo. He's supposed to be Pure Boo reincarnated and Pure Boo/Kid Boo is exempt from any God interference, he's just Boo himself and pure evil.
If Oob already conformed to Goku's expectations in the tournament, where he said someone besides us and Boo "might" win, and he can already fend off that level in base... Then merely pushing Oob to use that power effectively wouldn't be a challenge to Goku's highest states. There's that theory of mine Goku stacked the SSJs power in base, but that's just headcanon.
Goku sees how Oob can't even fly and says he has never had a master... Similar to Gohan stating to Goten "what about doing things in order"... And Oob also reminds Kid Gohan vs Raditz a little bit. Piccolo stated Gohan had amazing power but couldn't bring that power at will, so he'd train him to effectively use his power. He had displayed a 1307 BP Vs Raditz, and that number sounds like a good estimation more or less to his BP Vs Vegeta and Nappa, so all in all Piccolo made him capable of bringing that power more naturally... But kid Gohan could get way stronger as time went on, so yeah, naturally should Oob too.
The problem though is that Gohan's potential is way bigger than Goku's... If Oob has already a huge starting point like that, being Boo's reincarnation, it wouldn't be a stretch to think he'd have way more potential than Gohan. How can Goku expect to have an all out battle against someone whose potential would exceed his hugely? Not taking Super into account, were Goku to bring out Oob's potential assuming he has way more than even Gohan, Goku wouldn't hope to compete to that... So maybe Oob's max is limited to what Kid Boo displayed? Or dunno, maybe his maximum would be Super Boo/Buff Boo at most, but that's a little more random to think because he's the reincarnation of Boo alone, Pure Boo, not Boo who has merged with Godly beings. Super implies Oob has godly powers tho, but that's straight up BS imo. He's supposed to be Pure Boo reincarnated and Pure Boo/Kid Boo is exempt from any God interference, he's just Boo himself and pure evil.
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I think he's going to at least bring him up to Kid Buu level, maybe further, depending on how you interpret GT's scaling.
As an aside:
If the no SSJ rule is applying in End of Z, and Goku is considered the strongest in End of Z(original intentions without Super), then it requires one of two things to be the case:
1. If base Gotenks surpassed his own SSJ state or at least surpassed Fat Buu, then Mr. Buu would have to be stronger in End of Z than he was earlier since he is listed among Goku and Vegeta as possible tournament winners, which would require they be near to each other's power.
2. If Mr. Buu did not become stronger since his earlier appearance, then base Gotenks would have to be weaker than Fat Buu to justify Goku being the strongest with base Goku near to Mr. Buu's power.
As an aside:
If the no SSJ rule is applying in End of Z, and Goku is considered the strongest in End of Z(original intentions without Super), then it requires one of two things to be the case:
1. If base Gotenks surpassed his own SSJ state or at least surpassed Fat Buu, then Mr. Buu would have to be stronger in End of Z than he was earlier since he is listed among Goku and Vegeta as possible tournament winners, which would require they be near to each other's power.
2. If Mr. Buu did not become stronger since his earlier appearance, then base Gotenks would have to be weaker than Fat Buu to justify Goku being the strongest with base Goku near to Mr. Buu's power.
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I think if AT were asked who was the strongest pre BoG he would've said Goku, but if Gohan is still Ultimate it should be him going by the OG manga's logic.
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I like to think Goku didn't catch up to Gohan and that such was a barrier he wouldn't catch up to. While limits seem like a wild thing in DB, the thing with Old Kaioshin seemed more serious. Goku even kinda joked saying he sees it a lot, as a common power, but then Old Kaioshin stresses his as being different and taking wayyyy beyond the limits... Goku actually wonders "damn, how much potential does Gohan have?" when Gohan unleashes just a part of it... Gohan's facial structures change post the ritual and he seems way more perceptive and clever in general, even moreso than Piccolo in some instances, like feeling Dende's little chi and knowing Boo was up to something. And on top of that, doesn't need to go SSJ, as if he reached s final state of evolution totally suited for battle. If limits were taken seriously once in the series, I'd say that was the case... While the other instances were always temporary limits, limits that their current abilities would allow them to.
So if Gohan goes wayy beyond his natural limits, I like to think that's a plateau Goku would just never reach within the original story, not counting Super ofc. That helps having base Goku ~ Kid Boo at the end of Z and base Gotenks at ~ initial sensible Super Boo, as still establishing a solid gap between Goku and Gohan even at the end of Z, even though Goku bridged a lot of it. He could get even closer post training and fighting Oob but there would still be a decent layer separating both imo. Maybe Goku would reach SSJ3 Gotenks power at the most.
So if Gohan goes wayy beyond his natural limits, I like to think that's a plateau Goku would just never reach within the original story, not counting Super ofc. That helps having base Goku ~ Kid Boo at the end of Z and base Gotenks at ~ initial sensible Super Boo, as still establishing a solid gap between Goku and Gohan even at the end of Z, even though Goku bridged a lot of it. He could get even closer post training and fighting Oob but there would still be a decent layer separating both imo. Maybe Goku would reach SSJ3 Gotenks power at the most.
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Goku wouldn't have been willing to leave his family to train this kid if he was only going to reach Pure Boo level. Goku saw the potential that Oob had and knew that they would both push each other to new limits. Whether or not that would be stronger than the likes of Gotenks/Gohan is debatable, but Goku definitely believes he can get stronger through Oob.
Define only. Pure Buu was a level Goku couldn't defeat without SSJ3, unless you believe Oob was already Pure Buu level and Goku had progressed to the extent of being that level in his base form. Unless you believe that, I think Goku wanting a rematch from Pure Buu was enough of a reason to leave his family and train.
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Goku would leave his family for a pissing contest with Vegeta lol
Oob definitely has more potential than anyone else in the series. He’s the last goal of the series.
Oob definitely has more potential than anyone else in the series. He’s the last goal of the series.
If you go by pure manga cannonicity (SSJ3 is available only through otherworld training for unfused fighters, and Gohan's power up was magic), then Saiyans' normal limits in the living world are the SSJ2 level. So, yes, even if Uub cannot go past the Pure Buu level, he still has the greatest potential in the series.
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Well, Goku stated someone besides Mr. Boo might win and then later stated his expectations of Uub were met, only that he couldn't properly control his powers. So it seems pretty likely Oob was already displaying Kid Boo's levels of power but hadn't the proper control over it. The fact Goku's arm didn't get smashed from his kick and the fact he could go back and forth with Oob for a while suggests Goku's base is Mr. Boo's level at least.
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But what were Goku’s expectations? Didn’t he want the fight of his life?
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For some reason I think that Super Boo/Buff Boo is Kid Boo’s max potential even though it’s just the max potential Kid Boo has with the other Kais absorbed.
