Where do you place Pui Pui in comparison to Frieza Saga Tiers?

CroMagnumDVH

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UltimateGohkan said:
Pui Pui loses to anybody who above Saiyan Saga Vegeta. Vegeta was obviously toying with his ass.

Vegeta was toying with him, but that doesn't prove he's Saiyan Saga level. Can you explain it to me?
 

Animelover5487

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It's nothing about multipliers.

So, Base Goku already stronger than his SSJ form from seven years gets a hundred times stronger and is still only marginally stronger than SSJ2 Kid Gohan? Ok.....



One is Kaioshin being equal to Ssj Goku Cell Games,

Shin doesn't need to be equal to Cell Games SSJ Goku to be in a different dimension compared to Piccolo.

Another point is that Gohan said that Vegeta in base form while holding back against Pui Pui is stronger than anything Vegeta has ever shown before,

Gohan just said he got stronger, he never stated or even implied that he was > his Cell Games SSJG2 in base.

Kaioshin was shocked from Vegeta's performance even after seeing Ssj2 Gohan from the Tournament who's above Ssj Goku Cell Games

Kaioshin was also shocked about SSJ Cohen's power vs Dabura and even told Kibito about how powerful he was despite Kibito already witnessing SSJ2 Gohan's power at the tournament.
 

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CroMagnumDVH said:
Void said:
Also @CroMagnumDVH I don't know how you pull that off without miniscule multipliers.

It's nothing about multipliers. There are 3 points which support this actually. One is Kaioshin being equal to Ssj Goku Cell Games, while Pui Pui being above Kaioshin. The other is Kaioshin implying that The Saiyans can't beat Pui Pui, yet he was shocked that Vegeta in base form was that strong. Another point is that Gohan said that Vegeta in base form while holding back against Pui Pui is stronger than anything Vegeta has ever shown before, and he actually showed his Grade 2 Ssj form. They concluded that based on Vegeta fighting Pui Pui, yet if Pui Pui was fodder, then that won't be possible, which makes it possible. Kaioshin was shocked from Vegeta's performance even after seeing Ssj2 Gohan from the Tournament who's above Ssj Goku Cell Games

I don't see what implies Kaioshin ~ CG SS Goku.

As I said earlier, Kaioshin can't sense Pui Pui or Babidi's other minions. Kaioshin based his assessment of Pui Pui solely on the fact that Babidi is known for controlling strong fighters. He has no actual idea how strong Pui Pui is.

Kaioshin's reaction to base Vegeta implies he completely forgot about SS2 Gohan at the 25th TB.

Keep posting your views though, man. It generates discussion.
 

Diamond Ryan

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CroMagnumDVH said:








I have 2 questions for Y'all. I have Pui Pui above Ssj Goku Cell Games

1) Do you think this is plausible?

2) If you want to play Devil's advocate on this, what would you say?

I personally don't think it's plausible, as Vegeta took him down without transforming and I don't believe that Vegeta got over 50x stronger between the Cell and Boo arcs. If I were to take that viewpoint though, I would say that the boost the SSj forms gives decreased, as while Goku wasn't implied to have surpassed SSj2 Kid Gohan until Goku himself transformed into a SSj2, their base forms are implied by Dabra to be > Piccolo, who can put up a fight against a Cell Jr. That way, Pui Pui could be > SSj CG Goku without contradicting any of what was stated before.
 

CroMagnumDVH

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Animelover5487 said:
So, Base Goku already stronger than his SSJ form from seven years gets a hundred times stronger and is still only marginally stronger than SSJ2 Kid Gohan? Ok.....

Ssj2 Gohan CG is far stronger than just 2x Ssj Gohan CG. There's just so many evidence to show that Ssj2 Gohan cell games is far beyond Perfect Cell and 2x Ssj Gohan. It might sound absurd, but if you can't show evidence as to why that isn't possible, then you'd be appealing to the stone

Shin doesn't need to be equal to Cell Games SSJ Goku to be in a different dimension compared to Piccolo.

El Manga Legendario and the Manga actually suggest that this is true and possible.

Gohan just said he got stronger, he never stated or even implied that he was > his Cell Games SSJG2 in base.

Gohan said that he's stronger than before, and the last time he saw him is him fighting a Cell Junior. So Gohan is saying he is stronger than before, in context referring to the last time he saw him

Kaioshin was also shocked about SSJ Cohen's power vs Dabura and even told Kibito about how powerful he was despite Kibito already witnessing SSJ2 Gohan's power at the tournament.

He wasn't a Super Saiyan. He was a Super Saiyan 2. Regardless of the matter, Dragon Ball Kai implies that Gohan got stronger between the interval between The 25th Budokai and His time in Babidi's spaceship. The fact that it's hinted, makes it possible.

I don't see what implies Kaioshin ~ CG SS Goku.

El Manga Legendario implies it, and Manga supports it

As I said earlier, Kaioshin can't sense Pui Pui or Babidi's other minions. Kaioshin based his assessment of Pui Pui solely on the fact that Babidi is known for controlling strong fighters. He has no actual idea how strong Pui Pui is.

Wrong. He can deduce how powerful the opponents are. Similarly, in Kai he was shocked of Pui Pui's show off speed and said everyone must fight despite witnessing Ssj2 Gohan. Also, Babidi believes Pui Pui can take care of Kaioshin and being him alive to him, and there's no reason to doubt Babidi's judgement. Dabura also believes that the energies of the base sqotans are more than enough to fill half the meter yet it took Ssj2 Gohan's power to fill it up. Pikkon is canon in Kai, and he matched Ssj Goku. In the Buu Saga, Goku says no one is a match for him and that also includes his base form when he talks about trying fusion.

Kaioshin's reaction to base Vegeta implies he completely forgot about SS2 Gohan at the 25th TB.

Why

:kenshi

He didn't forget. It just means Base Vegeta > Ssj2 Gohan from the 25th Budokai. DB Kai implies Gohan got stronger after being attacked by Spopovitch and Yamu.

Keep posting your views though, man. It generates discussion.

Sure bro. I believe that having such discussions with friendly, cogent tone is the best way to burn some boredom in this site
 

CroMagnumDVH

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Diamond Ryan said:
CroMagnumDVH said:








I have 2 questions for Y'all. I have Pui Pui above Ssj Goku Cell Games

1) Do you think this is plausible?

2) If you want to play Devil's advocate on this, what would you say?

I personally don't think it's plausible, as Vegeta took him down without transforming and I don't believe that Vegeta got over 50x stronger between the Cell and Boo arcs. If I were to take that viewpoint though, I would say that the boost the SSj forms gives decreased, as while Goku wasn't implied to have surpassed SSj2 Kid Gohan until Goku himself transformed into a SSj2, their base forms are implied by Dabra to be > Piccolo, who can put up a fight against a Cell Jr. That way, Pui Pui could be > SSj CG Goku without contradicting any of what was stated before.

It mainly depends on if you believe that Base Saiyans can get this strong in 7 years. I find it pretty normal honestly since 7 years is a darn long time which they can manage alot in.
 

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Animelover5487

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Ssj2 Gohan CG is far stronger than just 2x Ssj Gohan CG. There's just so many evidence to show that Ssj2 Gohan cell games is far beyond Perfect Cell and 2x Ssj Gohan. It might sound absurd, but if you can't show evidence as to why that isn't possible, then you'd be appealing to the stone

While I support the notion of SSJ2 Kid Gohan being more than two times his SSJ power due to the heavy implications of him getting a rage boost, there is no reason to make it that much over two times.

El Manga Legendario and the Manga actually suggest that this is true and possible.

I haven't seen any source that says Shin is equal to Cell Games SSJ Goku.

Gohan said that he's stronger than before, and the last time he saw him is him fighting a Cell Junior. So Gohan is saying he is stronger than before, in context referring to the last time he saw him

Gohan knows Vegeta can transform so he isn't referring to base.

Kaioshin was also shocked about SSJ Cohen's power vs Dabura and even told Kibito about how powerful he was despite Kibito already witnessing SSJ2 Gohan's power at the tournament.

He wasn't a Super Saiyan. He was a Super Saiyan 2.

Going by the anime and Kai maybe. In the manga Gohan was explicitly a SSJ.

Regardless of the matter, Dragon Ball Kai implies that Gohan got stronger between the interval between The 25th Budokai and His time in Babidi's spaceship. The fact that it's hinted, makes it possible.

He couldn't have got that much stronger since he is still weaker than seven years ago.
 

CroMagnumDVH

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Animelover5487 said:
While I support the notion of SSJ2 Kid Gohan being more than two times his SSJ power due to the heavy implications of him getting a rage boost, there is no reason to make it that much over two times.

This here is a reason. There's no reason for Gohan not to be that powerful if it's not contradicted in the slightest at all. Funnily speaking, the Buu Saga quite heavily supports this in a very crazy manner. To have it far above Ssj2 multiplier is really fine if both of us agree that Rage Boost is above 2x Ssj

originally the difference between Ssj2 multiplier and Gohan's rage boost is unquantifiable so it could be far above Ssj2 multiplier or not that much far above it. The Buu Saga implies it's far above Ssj2 Multiplier, so that's a really enough reason.

I haven't seen any source that says Shin is equal to Cell Games SSJ Goku.

El Manga Legendario says that Kaioshin can be deduced to be equal to Cell Games Ssj Goku. Since the meaning of deduction is used here, it makes it plausible that Kaioshin is on that level. Which means Kaioshin is equal, if not above or partially below Ssj Goku CG

This same guide is created by his personal staff which Akira says they know more about DBZ than him. This guide also has information about some personal belongings related to Akira Toriyama himself.

Gohan knows Vegeta can transform so he isn't referring to base.

It is referring to base if you look at the context though. Gohan said that Vegeta is stronger than before while his base form was fighting Pui Pui so there's no reference to Grade 2 at all. So Gohan is referring strictly to his base form being above anything from before. Goku in base form being above pikkon is actually supported in the Manga, Kai and Chozenshu guide (the same guide which mentions multiple information about the Manga, Kai and Battle of Gods movie)

Going by the anime and Kai maybe. In the manga Gohan was explicitly a SSJ.

Even in the manga, Gohan was a Ssj2. The only thing that says otherwise is art. However that goes against all the evidence which supports the narrative that Gohan was a Ssj2. Dabura is equal to Cell if not superior, yet somehow Gohan gives Dabura trouble as a Super Saiyan? That's not logical to me... :giraffe


He couldn't have got that much stronger since he is still weaker than seven years ago.

His Ssj2 Form is, as implied by Daizenshuu 2
 

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CroMagnumDVH said:
UltimateGohkan said:
Pui Pui loses to anybody who above Saiyan Saga Vegeta. Vegeta was obviously toying with his ass.

Vegeta was toying with him, but that doesn't prove he's Saiyan Saga level. Can you explain it to me?

He expected 10x gravity to help him against Vegeta but considering guys like Saiyan Saga Goku could do 10x gravity on King Kais planet means he probably get stomped by Ginyu Saga Goku who did 100x Gravity while traveling to Namek.
 

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UltimateGohkan said:
He expected 10x gravity to help him against Vegeta but considering guys like Saiyan Saga Goku could do 10x gravity on King Kais planet means he probably get stomped by Ginyu Saga Goku who did 100x Gravity while traveling to Namek.

Feats and Statements completely say otherwise though. Pui Pui thinks that Vegeta can't survive in the gravity because he thinks Vegeta is a human, and no human has been shown to survive that gravity. Vegeta told Kid Trunks that 150x Gravity is too much for him, but using this logic he'd be Namek saga level, yet base trunks is arguably near Android 18's power as showcased in the Manga, Dragon ball Kai and Daizenshuu.
 

CroMagnumDVH

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Kyo said:
owo whats this

A Dragon Ball Guide created by Shueisha and Bird Studio, and its reliability is to be trusted since the source is even more reliable than Akira (Akira said that) and the guide has information on some of Akira's personal belongings.

Here's an example of it:

http://www.dbzeta.net/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=13732
 

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Gohan after he saw Vegeta defeat Pui-Pui without any trouble said Vegeta got much higher, so Vegeta's power against Pui-Pui > Cell-Games Vegeta.

:punk :punk :punk @ Pui-Pui being Saiyan-Saga Vegeta level.
 

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I never thought Pocus was special. I think Kaioshin overestimated him/underestimated Vegeta, so I put Pocus above the Ginyu Force, but weaker than 1st Form Frieza.
 

CroMagnumDVH

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2kewl4u said:
Pui-Pui being Saiyan-Saga Vegeta level.

Wut, you disagree with that and agree that Pui Pui is near Saiyan Saga Vegeta

:giraffe

Gohan compares Vegeta's base to Vegeta from the last time he saw him bruh, and so Base Vegeta > Grade 2 Ssj Vegeta Cell games
 

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CroMagnumDVH said:
Wut, you disagree with that and agree that Pui Pui is near Saiyan Saga Vegeta
It's pretty clear from his wording he's agreeing with you that Pui Pui is far stronger than Saiyan Arc Vegeta.
 

CroMagnumDVH

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Captain Cadaver said:
CroMagnumDVH said:
Wut, you disagree with that and agree that Pui Pui is near Saiyan Saga Vegeta
It's pretty clear from his wording he's agreeing with you that Pui Pui is far stronger than Saiyan Arc Vegeta.

O. I misunderstood Ig

 

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[mention]TheallpowerfulPocus[/mention] has a power lvl of 5
 

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