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Although not as theatric as SSJG Goku/Beerus, Gogeta/Omega tells us that Gogeta's striking ability is relative to universe-threatening power. He defeats ki-gathered pre-God Goku, and pre-God Saiyan fusion, but gets stopped by God Goku after a decent fight.

Looking at Burter specifically, it could be the case that this slogan was rooted in truth -- as far as he knew -- in the distant past, then morphed into purely an internal gimmick as undoubtedly higher level beings (Ginyu, Frieza) came about.

I think the fight comes to a halt after Goku styles on him to be honest. Before that, it'd look like a competitive spar (e.g. like their first fight, early/base, but roles reversed) Toughness is more of a factor when opposed by relentless beings like Kid Buu who will just smash the weaker...

Goku being a 'low class Saiyan' ought to make it both mind-boggling and frustrating at the same time. Although Goku is marked as being special after all, it makes you wonder how far another motivated Saiyan of that class would go under the tutelage of Goku's various masters.

No hard opinion on it. You could broadly categorise them all as being capable of chopping down the average grunt comfortably, but not having any firm battle accolades just yet. Videl would fit well into OG DB storylines involving local shenanigans.

Videl. I think she'd refrain from that brutal head-twisting kick she did to M. Spopovich though.

Vegeta heavily fixates on how he failed to beat Goku. We know Goku had help, but Vegeta doesn't care. On the flip side, Goku acknowledged that Vegeta bested him, but his team won and he was the underdog, so it's not as scathing to him.

@ahill1 I enjoyed the back and forth. @GreatSaiyaman123 Goku looked tired more than anything. He mentioned how it was a rough ride - the anime showed his pod smashing into things before landing. During the Namek escape, he was leaping from one ship to another like nothing, so I don't think it...

I don't think Goku & Trunks' gains can be linked to Gohan. We saw those two completely distance themselves from the future powerscaling, and having more longevity within the story provides the incentive for them to go far. On the other hand, Gohan was very much still within the domain of the...

Pointing out power differences where applicable is commonplace in DBZ. Since that is not presented concerning SSJ Trunks and Goku -- and instead, equality was indicated -- this provides clarity as to where they stood. Fans that create PL lists seem rarely satisfied with their own numbers in the...

Trunks did not say how strong he thought Goku was, nor was there any specificity in reference to the stories. I think I've said enough as to why I disagree on a micro-level. Looking at it from a macro-level (i.e. holding back) is the focal point of that part of the segment we were talking about...

It looks like Trunks just wanted to brag a bit to Goku. Trunks showed instances of that demeanor against Frieza. Instead of feeding into that, Goku decided to put it bluntly that Trunks was holding back this time. I would not funnel that sword defense into any meaningful powerscaling because...

Goku's courage is what can be taken away from that test. Deliberately choosing to do nothing while someone comes swinging a sword at you because you have confidence in your ability to determine that they will stop isn't something you see often, even for a brave fighter. Also a very unique...

It seemed that Gohan became the guy to outdo - like it was interchangeable between Goku and himself. For instance, when Trunks believed he had the strength to finally beat the artificial humans, Bulma expressed her scepticism by using Gohan as a measuring stick. Looking at it from the...

He said he made his gi in hope that he would be as strong as his father one day, then proceeded to say it's not just the clothes. Sounds like he achieved his goal.

Trying to 'resolve' official levels brings into question the foundation that is being stood on. 5 different people could give the same summary of a fight between character X and Y, yet all have different PL gaps for those beings. With the official PLs, Frieza makes up the majority of Goku's...

The series doesn't appear to have a fixed framework for how a PL differential translates to a fight beyond the stronger character generally being the favourite to win. Digging into numbers beyond that quickly becomes arbitrary. I'd argue that a PL doesn't act as much more than a supplementary...

@SIAD Frieza 100% - Official PL Goku SSJ (Namek) - Official PL Mecha Frieza - Stronger than his Namek self, but weaker than Namek SSJ Goku Future Gohan SSJ (1 Arm) - Around SSJ Goku (before death) like he alluded to in his talk with Trunks Future Trunks SSJ (Debut) - I assume you mean 17...

Trunks said Goku would get sick not too long after Mecha Frieza's defeat, so Future Goku (pre-sickness) is basically the same as before.

Moved. Please try to keep threads like this in the current area