DBS Manga Levels (Suck Shit)

[Void]

Yes. It helps me rationalize Cabba's strength, and Vegeta really was banged up after that fight.

I kind of like that, actually. It also helps rationalize Vegeta having less than 10% of his Blue power against Hit, he would've already been weakened when he used his Blue against Cabba and the form supposedly uses a lot of stamina.

That's a good point that I completely overlooked. It really makes the Blue multiplier look tiny though when you put it that way. Going by traditional multipliers, that would mean Super Saiyan Blue is only about an 800x multiplier from Base, which makes you wonder what Super Saiyan God is. It also makes me question why he didn't just use regular Super Saiyan if that was going to be about the same power level.

I looked at the chapter again and I think its something like Hit (Suppressed) > Less than 10% Blue Vegeta >~ SS Goku. I feel like Beerus comment about Super Saiyan God Goku being superior to Vegeta's less than 10% Blue implies that SS Goku wasn't.

You think so? I never got the feeling Hit was stronger still, just tricky with the time skipping.

I'm not too sure, really. After Whis gives his little speech about how Hit's technique only works on people at or below his own level, Hit still seems confident that he can beat SSG Goku with his time skip. Goku also goes right to Blue before attack FP Hit, so that's why I think it could be FP Hit > SSG Goku.

 

[Papasmurf]

So how did Gurd's timestop affect Gohan?

 

[SIAD]

I do not think so good Vegetto SSJ3> Goku SSJG.

  On the other hand, I really like the idea of increasing the SSJ2 multiplier for Vegeta vs. Goku Black. Since I do not see the problem that your SSJ2 is larger, considering that it has neither SSJ3 nor SSJG.

  Anyway I think that Goku and Vegeta became tremendously stronger when traveling to the Future, because Goku SSJR (First Appearance)> Goku SSJB Kaioken x10 (Universal Tournament).

 

[Pyro]

I'm trying to figure a way to put Godku ahead of SSj3 Vegetto.

The Kaioken x10 stuff isn't in the manga so I don't have to worry about that ridiculous bloating.

The Hit fight is posing a tricky issue.

 

[Void]

What's still bugging you about the Hit fight?

 

[Pyro]

The gaps and multipliers situation. And then I just remembered about Goku giving Trunks credit for surpassing Cell Games Gohan, so that might force me to lower things even further.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

The gaps and multipliers situation. And then I just remembered about Goku giving Trunks credit for surpassing Cell Games Gohan, so that might force me to lower things even further.

The reason why Goku used Gohan as a measure stick for Trunks was because Gohan was the strongest when Trunks was around.

 

[Pyro]

The gaps and multipliers situation. And then I just remembered about Goku giving Trunks credit for surpassing Cell Games Gohan, so that might force me to lower things even further.

The reason why Goku used Gohan as a measure stick for Trunks was because Gohan was the strongest when Trunks was around.

That's how I interpreted it before. I'm just saying.

 

[Future Warrior]

I don't see a reason for Goku to mention anyone else besides Gohan for comparison considering Trunks hasn't met any of the fighters that came after that saga. But then again, you'd think Goku would put more emphasize on Trunks's strength by saying even Gohan pales in comparison or something like that.

 

[Void]

I think the Viz release will help with that power statement. I'd like to see how they will word it. Does Goku say he's "far stronger than Gohan" or just stronger? I'd like to see.

 

[Papasmurf]

In the translations I've read he only says "stronger," not "far stronger."

 

[Pyro]

We know he would have to be quite a bit stronger since Goku's done a shitload of training.

 

[Papasmurf]

Yeah, that's why the manga's power chain is generally inconsistent as well.

Also, I think you underrate Kibito and Zamasu. Kaioshit claims Zamasu to be top tier as far as all 12 universes' Kaioshins go, so he should at least be at fatty Kaioshin or South Kaioshin's league imo.

 

[Diamond Ryan]

According to the Viz strength checker, Vados says Frost is the strongest warrior in universe 6.

Ch. 9, pg. 27.7
Context: Frost and Goku resume their fight after Frost has transformed
Champa: “That’s it! Frost is one step ahead.”
Vados: “Of course. He’s the strongest warrior in our universe.”

Beerus also states that SSj Goku should beat Hit in physical power. So we arrive at this power chain?

SSj Goku > Frost > Hit (Suppressed)

Although that chain doesn't make much sense, that seems to be what I'm getting here.

 

[Pyro]

Yeah, that's why the manga's power chain is generally inconsistent as well.

Also, I think you underrate Kibito and Zamasu. Kaioshit claims Zamasu to be top tier as far as all 12 universes' Kaioshins go, so he should at least be at fatty Kaioshin or South Kaioshin's league imo.

I'll fix. I guess I can accept Kibito training and getting a lot stronger than he was before. Shit happens.

 

[Pyro]

According to the Viz strength checker, Vados says Frost is the strongest warrior in universe 6.

Ch. 9, pg. 27.7
Context: Frost and Goku resume their fight after Frost has transformed
Champa: “That’s it! Frost is one step ahead.”
Vados: “Of course. He’s the strongest warrior in our universe.”

Beerus also states that SSj Goku should beat Hit in physical power. So we arrive at this power chain?

SSj Goku > Frost > Hit (Suppressed)

Although that chain doesn't make much sense, that seems to be what I'm getting here.

I don't understand that because obviously Hit was a lot stronger than Frost, and Vados didn't show shock at all. Suppressed Hit was on SSj Goku's level too.

 

[Void]

[mention]Chet Lemon[/mention] any ideas in response to my post on page 2? Its all speculative, but I'm looking for theories and stuff to bounce around.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

Kibito must have been training in 4 months.

 

[Pyro]

[mention]Chet Lemon[/mention] any ideas in response to my post on page 2? Its all speculative, but I'm looking for theories and stuff to bounce around.

Boyyyyyy, I'm saving up something deliriously scrumptious for that.

 

[Pyro]

I looked at the chapter again and I think its something like Hit (Suppressed) > Less than 10% Blue Vegeta >~ SS Goku. I feel like Beerus comment about Super Saiyan God Goku being superior to Vegeta's less than 10% Blue implies that SS Goku wasn't.

I read the fights again. Obviously Vegeta didn't stand a chance. He was utterly beaten down without landing a single hit. The gap is giant there, not helped at all by Hit's ability.

Base Goku wasn't doing so hot either. He was being punched back with ease by a smiling Hit. The only reason he did anything was because he figured out Hit's ability. Even then, he transformed after doing so, implying that was merely a feeling out stage and he'd actually try with Super Saiyan.

Super Saiyan Goku was about equal with Hit, albeit wearing down and becoming weaker.

Super Saiyan God Goku was far superior.

I can dig Hit's full power being a bit stronger than Super Saiyan God Goku, but I'll just keep them equal for now. I didn't really see a reason to put Hit above him or vice versa.

I think I'm just going to go with Hit using different levels of effort against Vegeta and Goku. He obviously had to have used two different levels if he was being whacked by Base Goku yet staying on par with Super Saiyan Goku. It's the only way to prevent a mathematical retardation.

Hit = SSG Goku >>> Hit (suppression 1) > SSB Vegeta > Hit (suppression 3) >~ SSj Goku >>> Hit (suppression 2) ~ Base Goku