Future Saga MADNESS

[p123]

Yea honestly, when you look over the Freeza Saga, imagine if we didn't have the power levels, we would assume it's major bloat. The jump from Freeza's top guys to Ginyu Force, to Ginyu to Freeza was absurd. We would never accept those without the numbers. It's tough to bloat, but sometimes it's necessary. I think it's necessary here.

 

[Future Warrior]

Like I said, Vegeta doesn't even need to be ahead of Mecha Freeza if you want to reduce the bloat. Just have him at Super Saiyan at a level slightly above his Namek level.

I think it boils down to where you have Vegeta (Mecha Arc) in comparison to Goku (Freeza arc).

 

[SSJ2]

Like I said, Vegeta doesn't even need to be ahead of Mecha Freeza if you want to reduce the bloat. Just have him at Super Saiyan at a level slightly above his Namek level.

I think it boils down to where you have Vegeta (Mecha Arc) in comparison to Goku (Freeza arc).

Yeah, probably slightly ahead of Namek Goku at best. His level of power is still revered.

 

[p123]

Well what people don't realize is how much more powerful Goku was than Vegeta on Namek. The gap is tremendous.

Freeza (Max Initial) > Goku (Max Base) > Freeza (Warming up) >= Goku (Initial) > Freeza (Initial) > Vegeta

 

[SSJ2]

Thinking of it, does Mecha Vegeta even have to be above Namek Goku? The only thing is Goku asking if he or Piccolo beat Freeza, but he was assuming Trunks' huge ki was theirs.

 

[p123]

I think so, no real way to justify Vegeta not gaining at least that much.

 

[Pyro]

I can stomach Mecha Freeza being equal to Namek Goku. It's not much of a boost for him, but it's not necessarily contradicting his claims of victory.

Post-Namek Vegeta is largely irrelevant, so I don't care whether he's still below Namek Goku or somewhat above him. So long as he's noticeably behind Trunks.

 

[Kyo]

Think mecha freeza considered Goku getting stronger potentially?

Vegeta's a non-factor imo. Zero mention in the manga.

 

[p123]

It is quite possible that Freeza factored in Goku getting stronger when he made his comment. We never discuss this much though.

I don't see why not have Vegeta as a Super Saiyan. It's a knee jerk reaction to keep things minimalist, but for what?

 

[Kyo]

I think vegeta being ssj is fine, I just don't see the need to consider his level when the series never does.

 

[ahill1]

I don't see Vegeta SSJ > Mecha Freeza as a necessity, do you? There was a pretty big gap between Vegeta and Goku at Namek, so it could be fine if Vegeta was still below or equal Namek's level.

Also, with the chain of Yardrat Goku > Trunks > 1 arm Gohan >> 2 arms Gohan > Vegeta, we would have a humongous gap between Yardrat Goku and Mecha saga Vegeta. How do you feel about that?

 

[p123]

The entire point of this forum is to consider levels the story has not.

Yea, I think Vegeta should be over Cyborg Freeza at least. Just marginally. Would be a shame if he can't at least trump that.

And yes, there is going to be a massive difference in power from Yardrat Goku to Trunks Saga Vegeta.

Perhaps that can be explained by Super Saiyan's being able to increase significantly, whereas people stuck on base are fucked at this level. Nothing suggests that Super Saiyan powers don't grow a shit ton.

Kid Trunks, Future Gohan, the Super Saiyans in the Androids Saga all experienced quite massive gains.

 

[Kyo]

To rephrase, I don't consider it because there's just nothing to go off of. Say he was SSJ--which we don't know, then what makes him stronger than Freeza? It just feels right if he is? If there's a good argument though then that's cool (didn't read full thread).

 

[ahill1]

But so did Goku before attaining SSJ, right? I think the base level grows faster when the Saiyans are approaching SSJ, explaining Vegeta and Goku's huge Zenkais at Namek.

 

[p123]

Why wouldn't he be stronger than Freeza? Goku was stronger than Freeza, marginally so, but still stronger. You are telling me in five years time, Vegeta can't at least close that gap?

 

[SSJ2]

What's wrong with thinking he stopped training after Goku died?

 

[Future Warrior]

That's actually a valid point.

 

[ahill1]

That point is being presented for a while lol.

 

[SSJ2]

That point is being presented for a while lol.

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[Kyo]

That point is being presented for a while lol.

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