Vegito and Gogeta

[Pocket-God]

So I was wondering.....why do people have Vegito so insanely above Gogeta? I mean yeah sure I agree Vegito is stronger than Gogeta but why do people have Super Vegito > SSJ3 Gogeta?

Can't it just go like this? :|
SSJ4 Vegito > SSJ4 Gogeta > SSJ3 Vegito > SSJ3 Gogeta > SSJ2 Vegito > SSJ2 Gogeta > SSJ Vegito > SSJ Gogeta > Base Vegito > Base Gogeta.

 

[SSJ2]

Gogeta is stated in the manga not to be able to beat Gohan Boo, so it puts a cap on his power.

 

[Papasmurf]

Gogeta has no feats putting him above anyone but base Super Boo and SSJ3 Gotenks. On the same token, why do so many people have Gogeta leaps and bound above Gotenks, despite Trunks managing to cause Vegeta some trouble dodging his attacks? Many of these guys have Gogeta as much as like 10x Gotenks or more, when they use the same method of fusion and aren't worlds apart in power. Gotenks also even improved over the Rosat, yet many have SSJ Gogeta >> SSJ3 Gotenks. So they're largely guilty of the same, and then some.

 

[Pocket-God]

Gogeta is stated in the manga not to be able to beat Gohan Boo, so it puts a cap on his power.

Oh really? I didn't know that XD

Gogeta has no feats putting him above anyone but base Super Boo and SSJ3 Gotenks. On the same token, why do so many people have Gogeta leaps and bound above Gotenks, despite Trunks managing to cause Vegeta some trouble dodging his attacks? Many of these guys have Gogeta as much as like 10x Gotenks or more, when they use the same method of fusion and aren't worlds apart in power. Gotenks also even improved over the Rosat, yet many have SSJ Gogeta >> SSJ3 Gotenks. So they're largely guilty of the same, and then some.

Yeah but Gogeta being a crap ton stronger than Gotenks makes sense, well to me at least, I mean Gogeta is a fusion of two SSJ2 (Goku is an SSJ3 but he has to lower his power to Vegeta's right?) while Gotenks is just the fusion of two basic super saiyans.

I usually tend to place Super Janemba in the same ball park as Mystic Gohan, which would place Super Gogeta at around Buutenks level wouldn't it?
Where do you place Super Gogeta and Super Janemba?

 

[Papasmurf]

SSJ2 and SSJ3 wouldn't make any difference whatsoever unless one properly fuses in said forms. You may as well be arguing that Super Boo would've received power from Gotenks' Super Saiyan 3 form after absorbing him in base, or that Gotenks' two halves having SSJ influenced him in base somehow when he got his ass kicked by Fat Boo who's much weaker than his own SSJ state.

The movies are non-canon and don't matter, but Janenba was only a bit stronger than SSJ3 Goku in my opinion considering he took some damage from his attacks and needed his reality warping powers to dominate him. He doesn't need to be at Gohan's level at all unless you go by that Janenba > SSJ3 Goku > Hildegarn statement that a Toei webmaster made, but that defies canon entirely by having Goku far above Gotenks and Gohan.

 

[Pocket-God]

I wasn't really referring to the forms specifically, I was referring to the fact that their full powers are a lot higher than the kids that's all.

Didn't Vegeta mention that Goku was a lot stronger in that movie? and in base Goku was comparable to Pikkon so that's gotta count for something.

But how do you suggest it should go, something like this? Mystic Gohan > Super Gogeta > Super Janemba > Super Buu

 

[Papasmurf]

I would go with SSJ Gogeta > SSJ Gotenks post rosat > SSJ gotenks pre-Rosat >= Janenba > SSJ3 Goku going by the feats in that movie, since Gogeta only really needs to have the same gap SSJ2 Gohan had on Bojack to do what he did to Janenba. Goku also equalized his power to Vegeta when they fused, so although I do agree he probably got stronger somehow (alternate universe logic I guess...), they'd only be as strong as (Vegeta + suppressed goku) x Fusion multiplier

I still don't consider their full powers relevant when they fuse in a lesser form. Gotenks' power is lessened when he fuses in base as oppose to Super Saiyan and by the fact that Trunks suppresses himself slightly to fuse with Goten, so why would higher forms that aren't even being used count when they merge in base or SSJ? That just never made sense to me. That's like Future Trunks in the Cell Games fusing with Boo arc Gohan or something and getting extra power from Gohan's SSJ2 or Trunks' SSJg3. Makes no sense.

 

[Pocket-God]

Holy Jeez, Janemba gets no love from you then I guess XD
I brought up Goku being stronger in that movie in order to make Janemba stronger, not Gogeta but your point still stands anyway.

Ah I suppose so, forgive my nubness when it comes to fusion, I haven't really messed around with fusion all that much.

 

[MissingUTAH]

Vegetto has a power Gogeta doesn't. Whenever people are talking about his power level, he has this strange power to make even the most die-hard manga fans use the anime canon for his power. Either that, or you guys are just massively underestimating Gogeta. The way I see it, SSJ Anime Vegetto is way, way above SSJ3 Gogeta, but Manga Vegetto is at most twice as strong as Gogeta. The problem is that since Buuhan can regenerate so well, even if they could pull off the fusion dance, which as we know from Fusion Reborn was a risky gamble, SSJ2 Gogeta probably couldn't have killed him in 30 minutes, and SSJ3 Gogeta probably couldn't have killed him in 5 minutes.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

People didn't read the manga clearly that's why.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

People didn't read the manga clearly that's why.

 

[SSJ2]

Probably read the manga 8 more times than you have.

 

[kriss-]

Having Gogeta so weak is unnecessary. It all depends on where you have the kids in comparison to the adults. If people read the Manga correctly, they would realize that the boys had an extremely hard time with Android 18, and they couldn't gain the upper-hand, even as Super Saiyans. They tend to wipe their ass by saying it was the suit that restricted their movements, but a suit doesn't affect your durability or strength level, so it's an unnecessary and illogical point. Sparring with Vegeta and Gohan is completely different from an actual fight where they are trying to win, that and if Gohan really wanted to, he could smash his little brother to such a degree that Goten wouldn't be able to land a hit or follow his movements, this is a stated fact and the gap between them is more tremendous than one might think.

Under this logic, Gogeta would be a whole lot stronger than Gotenks.

 

[MissingUTAH]

I completely agree. I don't know why people think Goten and Trunks are anywhere close to their parents.

 

[Tapion]

Trunks ALONE was capable of trading blows with Android 18. And don't say that she was holding back because she slammed their head into the ring, that would kill a human with ease and she should be aware of that. Trunks was capable of punching Vegeta, who is known for his rigorousness, and took a REFLEX punch with barely a bruise. When fighting Goten, Gohan had his Super Saiyan aura(which suggests that he wasn't holding back and if he was, certainly wasn't by much), and was forced into the air when fighting Goten. Not only that, but comparisons in the manga show us that Gohan had more trouble blocking a kick from Goten than blocking a kick from Cell(vs. Goku).

You can say what you want, but nothing undo the fact that official sources say that Goten's power is comparable to Gohan's power, and the fact that the own Gohan said that Goten would surpass him SOON.

 

[kriss-]

The Daizenshuu is all incorrect and clearly contradicts the official source, which is the Manga. Android 18 was clearly holding back power in order not to kill anyone, she did not want to be disqualified and that's not allowed, it would take some arrogance to overlook this important point. As a Super Saiyan, he still could not one shot Android 18 or stand there and tank everything she had to offer.

Kuririn calls Piccolo the strongest one among Goten, Trunks and himself. Yet Piccolo is fodder to Kaioshin who in turn is fodder to Dabra, whose around the strength of Teen Gohan SSj.

If you believe that two Semi-Perfect Cells can be defeated by Android 18 under any circumstances, then you would have a point, but we all know that is impossible.

 

[SSJ2]

Compare 18 vs Vegeta to 18 vs the kids. You see what she looks like when she's toying vs what she looks like when she is trying. Against Vegeta she is smiling, making jokes about his power, and acting arrogant. Against the kids she is cautious, serious, and doesn't take any risks.

I don't get what Semi Cell has to do with this, as nobody is arguing that the kids are on Semi Cell's level.

 

[kriss-]

No people are arguing they're Goku Mssj level.

 

[SSJ2]

Not in Base fam.

 

[kriss-]

Teen Gohan Ssj > Kaioshin > Piccolo > Trunks SSj >= Goten SSj

Is implied