What is Raditz's power level?

[Power Level Guy]

That if Raditz was truly 1500, a loss of courage doesn't seem warranted given that he was already aware of Gohan being extraordinary. Surprise yes, but a loss of courage over a weaker fighter doesn't make sense to me.

1,200 doesn’t rival 1,500 though how is 1,500 considered? Ah yes I see your point now why would a weaker fighter drop your courage I see

 

[Hector]

1,200 doesn’t rival 1,500 though how is 1,500 considered? Ah yes I see your point now why would a weaker fighter drop your courage I see

If 1,330 is "barely over 1,000" I don't see why 1,200 can't rival 1,500.

 

[Power Level Guy]

If 1,330 is "barely over 1,000" I don't see why 1,200 can't rival 1,500.

Because we have evidence it can't. Goku had no chance against FP Vegeta. An 88% gap is too much to overcome. This gap is significantly greater than that.

 

[SSJ2]

1,200 doesn’t rival 1,500 though how is 1,500 considered? Ah yes I see your point now why would a weaker fighter drop your courage I see

1500 is the Daizenshuu number that many use. I agree with you.

 

[GreatSaiyaman123]

Because we have evidence it can't. Goku had no chance against FP Vegeta. An 88% gap is too much to overcome. This gap is significantly greater than that.

But one thing has nothing to do with the other. One is just comparing numbers, the other is fight perfomances.

The way I see it, 1500 and 1200 can be lumped together from the perspective of guys like Nappa and Vegeta. From their perspective, 1200 and 1500 are equally worthless. Might as well lump them together.

On the other hand, Raditz struggling with a <1000 KHH and being mortally wounded by 1300ish powers puts a hard cap on his power. If not for the Saibamen comparison I’d put him at 1000.

 

[Power Level Guy]

But one thing has nothing to do with the other. One is just comparing numbers, the other is fight perfomances.

Sure, but the fight performances are based on the numbers.

The way I see it, 1500 and 1200 can be lumped together from the perspective of guys like Nappa and Vegeta. From their perspective, 1200 and 1500 are equally worthless. Might as well lump them together.

I can see that, Zarbon and Vegeta are suggested to rival each other by Krillen, as well as Majin Vegeta and Kid Gohan.

On the other hand, Raditz struggling with a <1000 KHH and being mortally wounded by 1300ish powers puts a hard cap on his power. If not for the Saibamen comparison I’d put him at 1000.

Yeah. Although recently I began thinking that Raditz still isn't at full power when he blocks the Kamehameha. But I need more time on that.

 

[GreatSaiyaman123]

I can see that, Zarbon and Vegeta are suggested to rival each other by Krillen, as well as Majin Vegeta and Kid Gohan.

Exactly. Ki sensing seems to be a bit foggy. Numbers should be more precise, but in this case the gap is so big the difference becomes neglible. 1200 and 1500 would fare the same way against 8k and 18k.

What do you make of Vegeta saying Raditz died to powers "barely above 1000"? I think he says that as in, "it's not even close to 2000".

Yeah. Although recently I began thinking that Raditz still isn't at full power when he blocks the Kamehameha. But I need more time on that.

I don't really see that tbh. Raditz impulse was to not take it and he really had to brace himself for it.

 

[Power Level Guy]

Exactly. Ki sensing seems to be a bit foggy. Numbers should be more precise, but in this case the gap is so big the difference becomes neglible. 1200 and 1500 would fare the same way against 8k and 18k.

What do you make of Vegeta saying Raditz died to powers "barely above 1000"? I think he says that as in, "it's not even close to 2000".

I can see that being the lens of Vegeta and Nappa, but in this situation, it still doesn't work. The term "rivals" cannot be so vague, whereas the term, "powers barely over 1,000" definitely takes that lens into account. These are two separate issues.

I don't really see that tbh. Raditz impulse was to not take it and he really had to brace himself for it.

Piccolo's comments seem to suggest it. "What speed!", suggesting Raditz hasn't shown that type of speed previously. Remember, Piccolo was watching the whole time, he is noticing Raditz moving faster than before.

 

[Hector]

Yeah. Although recently I began thinking that Raditz still isn't at full power when he blocks the Kamehameha. But I need more time on that.

On the other hand, Raditz struggling with a <1000 KHH and being mortally wounded by 1300ish powers puts a hard cap on his power. If not for the Saibamen comparison I’d put him at 1000.

Maybe Special Beam Cannon has a piercing effect.

 

[GreatSaiyaman123]

Maybe Special Beam Cannon has a piercing effect.

Then what was the point of giving it a power level?

Raditz’s reaction to the level alone should be very telling, but he had the same reaction to Goku’s Kamehameha so idk

 

[Hector]

Then what was the point of giving it a power level?

There must be a limit to how higher a power level you can kill with a piercing effect. Unless you believe in the manga Krillin's kienzan could've killed Perfect Cell.

 

[KyuubiAhri]

K

1375 seems high to me, since he had to exert effort stopping the 916 KHH. Wouldn't he just be able to tank it at that PL? I'd say 1200 or 1250

Kamehameha was higher

it was 900+ and rising

could be above 1k too due to vegetas comment

 

[KyuubiAhri]

Wikia and movie pamphlet lists him at 1600

 

[ahill1]

Yeah I think there's more leeway in the statement of "barely over 1500". From their point of view, Vegeta was the one who stated that, it wouldn't make much of a difference to specify 1,300 is actually considerably above 1,000 because the power in that range was still all the same to them.

On the other hand, a specific comparison was drawn between Raditz and the Saibaimen. Here it is hard to justify being vague because they know a 1.3x difference can make a fight very one sided. And as per the original manga, Tenshinhan was 1,830 and Yamcha, 1480... Yamcha would have won and had shown himself to be superior to the Saibaimen, dying because he was unlucky. Since Nappa was drawing a direct comparison to Raditz, with guys who ranged above the Saibaimen but were still useless to them overall, it makes more sense for the word rival to be more strict here. Since Nappa was speaking about guys who didn't even reach the 2,000 and he could pinpoint a clear difference between them and the Saibaimen, being more specific about the word rivalry makes sense here. If a 1,500 would actually make a different performance against the fights he judged as "again..." then it wouldn't make sense to bring Raditz, as a means to show how they deal with an opponent almost as strong as Raditz.

Funnily enough, EML has a statement that the Saibaimen are close to Raditz in power... And that the soldiers which Kuririn and Gohan took out when they were read as "about 1,500$ by Zarbon had power levels of 1,200... Which shows how much of a 1,500 vs 1,200 difference makes in a fight...

Which again, there's all that with Raditz being pretty damaged at Gohan's attack when he was in shock but not totally off guard as he read the power in his scouter so he knew what to expect. And although Piccolo's Makankosappo had piercing properties, just the fact Raditz read such power registered as 1,330 and made everything possible to stop it before it could be fired... Makes the 1,500 figure just too unrealistic imo. That would be liking 18k Vegeta feeling threatened by non-amplified Kaioken Goku (16k) attacks and feeling a sense of danger... Just wouldn't happen. Vegeta vs Zarbon for instance, which I believe is a similar 88% gap, Vegeta chopped Zarbon's blast away, albeit with effort, but did so, smiling before he chopped it away... That's the level of danger Raditz should face those attacks imo. He could be very surprised at their strength going to that levels, but by knowing it wouldn't be a risk to his life, there would be no need to sweat bullets.

I'd say 1,300 seems fine to me. If there is a Daizenshuu guide claiming one thing, EML claimed they were close in power.

 

[Yoshi]

What about 1,350?