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You have two fighters who are on par with one another and then another assisting Vegeta who can use Kienzan. They're liabilities but that doesn't mean they can't help in some capacity.

Assuming Frieza doesn't ramp up his speed and power, I think so.

Doesn't have to be a 2x power-up but can be if you choose to ignore the official 3 million figure.

Not sure. Why?

You're already dismissing the fact that Vegeta claimed that they are all gradually getting stronger which is what Vegeta expects from clashing with First Form Frieza. By the time he fights Initial Final Form Frieza, they're all pretty much reaching their limits and Vegeta doesn't want to take...

I'm sorry but none of these people deserve to be on this site other than jplaya I guess.

It's really not confusing. Vegeta was rapidly growing much like Gohan's and Kuririn's were as a result of his body getting closer to becoming a Super Saiyan. Vegeta even says as much which is what we finally see with Goku why he skyrockets to the millions without using Kaioken. The power nap...

It doesn't matter. Hit is still the strongest if his abilities enable him to compete with KKx10 Blue Goku. And regardless of that, Gowasu was referring to Black's power exclusively when he made that claim because he was emphasizing how powerful Merged Zamasu had become thanks to Black being the...

That wouldn't pertain to Hit.

We were given an explanation as to why the Kaioken was conveniently ignored. Kaioken combined with Blue forced Goku beyond his limits which meant it was something he had to refrain from using. The series acknowledges that Goku used Kaioken against Hit and has an entire episode revolving around...

It's a weird argument in general because the only moment he's red is when he was battling Hit to create a hype moment leading up to the Kamehameha. I don't see anything indicative about it relating to power. That is your subtext that is purely speculative. Gowasu clearly watched KKx10 Blue...

What does this mean? I don't think the concept of Goku being the strongest stems from Toei. It always came from Toriyama. I don't think GT is even relevant when considering what Toriyama always intended for Goku whether it is Super or EoZ.

I don't get the argument. Goku was never fully red against Toppo and Jiren either from what I recall. Regardless, I think Super Saiyan God Goku already surpassed RoF Golden Frieza. Goku had to have gotten over 10x stronger to surpass SSJR Goku Black who was the strongest mortal Gowasu had ever...

I don't know. I don't remember much of GT but I don't really thinks it concerns Toriyama in regards to what his original message was. I do recall people making the case that Rildo must have surpassed Buuhan so for Base Goku to perform as well as he did against Rildo a child-like body would...

Not necessarily. Goku's outlook about Uub is for the future. He's looking forward to fighting him once he masters his power. Once Uub masters his powers, he should be stronger than Gohan and Gotenks.

Piccolo says that Goku hasn't been this way in a long time. The implication is that Gohan and Gotenks can't create that feeling but Uub's potential can. That's what's exciting about it. If Goku believed Uub couldn't surpass Gohan and Gotenks, then there would have been nothing left for Goku...

It's patently stated in the closing scene when Goku takes off. Training Uub was all about giving Goku a good fight rather than merely just training him which would imply that Uub was stronger than Gohan and Gotenks if Goku was more excited to fight him over those two. Even if Gohan was a...

I am talking strictly the original manga. What is the difference between the anime and manga? In the manga, we are blatantly told that Goku is leaving his family and friends so he can enjoy a good fight with Uub. Gotenks and Gohan are present and yet Goku bets everything on Uub so that he'd have...

What's the difference?

It's not feelings. The narrative literally tells us this is the case.