Search results

I watched episode 177. There is that one moment when Gohan asks why Goku won't get serious, and Trunks looks surprised, with Vegeta saying he knew it. If anything that could be used to say Warmup Goku = or even > 50% Goku. That would actually nerf the power scale! I mean hey, if the anime is...

Our responses are getting exponentially longer so I'll cut to the meat of what is really in contention, which is mostly just these points. ⬆️ We agree 50% Goku > Warm up Cell(Cell Games) = Warm up Goku(Cell Games). We agree 50% Goku > Super Vegeta. Beyond this the issue lies with what is and...

I would just focus on Krillin's statement as what would suggest Goku surpasses Grade 3 Trunks, as Goku's earlier statement is focused on the ambiguity of Cell's power. Even taking that position, Cell commenting about drawing out more power doesn't tell us how much more it will be, just that...

It looked that way. When you said Goku saying he can't guess Cell's strength and says he can't beat Cell means Cell will show more power, weren't you using that to support expected Cell > Grade 3 Trunks? Piccolo wants Goku's opinion on his own power, but Cell is just waiting for the games to...

The point I'm trying to make is that what you are using to justify that position is being used through fallacious reasoning. You don't need to use Goku's quotes to justify 50% Goku exceeding all prior powers. His quotes in and of themselves don't do that, but you can scale through other evidence...

Ok it just seemed like you invested a lot into the scaling for 50% Goku > Grade 3 Trunks based on these quotes from Goku so it looked to me that you might have the sunk cost fallacy. You could scale it that way even without those quotes. For example, say post-RoSaT Piccolo surpassed Super Vegeta...

That's only if you take Goku's estimate to stem from using Cell's maximum power from earlier as the minimum benchmark, the power Goku says is "not serious." With Cell likely being the type to suppress when not fighting this doesn't have to be the case. Cell says he wants to test the power of...

@Power Level Guy I revisited my discussion with ChatGPT, providing the original text for analysis. The interpretation that Goku's statements reflect his uncertainty about Cell's power, rather than affirming Cell will exceed previously known levels, is well-supported. The URL isn't working so...

Things that are counterintuitive can be true. Because Goku should surpass the best that the Z fighters can do or have shown to do to be in line with Krillin's statement. No one says Goku surpassed everyone until Krillin says it at the Cell Games. That could allow the possibility that prior to...

Saying we should believe something because it's common sense is the appeal to common sense fallacy. Krillin saying Goku surpassed everyone can mean Goku > Grade 3 Trunks & Cell Games Vegeta/Trunks whether or not CG Vegeta & Trunks are > Grade 3 Trunks(perfect cell Saga), because in either case...

Appeal to common sense fallacy. You're assuming I'm thinking it means Goku CG > Vegeta/Trunks pre-Cell Games and affirmatively excluding Cell Games as part of the equation but I never said that. You still don't understand what I'm doing here. You're turning this into a contest about the...

Bandwagon fallacy hmm? I never said that. And again you are shifting burden of proof for something I'm not even saying. Let me put it to you this way: In the manga when Goku uses full power at the Cell Games, Krillin says that Goku has surpassed everyone. This scene is actually missing in the...

I have no burden of proof because I'm not affirming that to be the case. What is it that you think I said? Because what I said in my last post doesn't make sense with what you just said. It looks like you think I said Goku is affirming to them that he thinks suppressed Cell in the arena is...

And "current Cell" can easily mean resting suppressed Cell in the arena that could be less than the power he used against Trunks. So when Goku says he will be weaker than Cell as far as the Z Fighters know Goku could be saying Goku < Cell vs Trunks.

It does not. It is affirming Goku < Cell, not Cell > everything prior. Notice that no one makes a reaction to Goku saying he doesn't know how strong serious Cell will be, rather they react to Goku saying he can't beat Cell. Let me remind you again, I'm not saying your conclusion for expected...

I'm saying your cited evidence isn't supporting your claim. I'm not saying your claim or conclusion is wrong. I'm saying you need different evidence. Please understand the difference. If expected Cell > everything prior, it's not for the reasons you are citing. Fallacy of the Undistributed...

Cell standing in the arena is suppressed. You're also using a viz-ism I think. The original quote is talking about Cell being serious, as in fighting. Even in your quote he doesn't say how Cell compares to any level. His not affirming Cell being stronger as much as he's affirming himself to be...

I heard the Japanese call him Slim Buu but Fit Buu just fits so much better lol. Fit Buu rings-out base Goku so it's fair to say he became somewhat stronger than base Goku. It's a ludicrous leap in power in the anime.

He does not. He says he probably can't beat Cell. He doesn't tell the other Z-Fighters that Cell is withholding more power. Korin does not use such descriptions as that. He simply says Cell hasn't shown his full power yet. He doesn't say how the prior power compares to Cell's expected power. He...

Isn't it quite odd that: Despite supposedly being more powerful than Grade III Trunks, no one draws a comparison between 50% Goku and Trunks. Despite being even more powerful than Cell's power used vs Trunks, no one draws a comparison between 50% Goku and that level of Cell. Cell never tells...