Base Goku (DBS) vs SSj3 Goku (Z)

[Evil Vegeta]

No, you think it does. If Gohan put his mind to it, he's stronger, but he didn't. Oh well, at least we have the Daizenshuu to clear that up.

Gohan did put his mind to it and proceeded to get enraged on top of that. Enraged Gohan>Gohan in general. Therefore, Gohan>Piccolo. Something actually displayed in the story.

No the Super Saiyan Kids aren't stronger than #18, otherwise they would've been stated to be part of the top 10 strongest on earth.

Using this ridiculous logic, Roshi, Tien, and Krillin were also stronger than the kids back during the Boo saga as well.

And the kids weren't selected because they were inexperienced. Goku flat-out said their power wasn't the issue.

Doesn't matter according to your logic. Gohan=Gohan and the Daizenshuu apparently makes no distinction. So Gohan can't surpass Goten.

Yes, my logic even though your infallible Daiz says Goten=Gohan. One which requires you to throw in your own spin to make the bio logical.

This is expanded on in the anime.

Pretty sure Goten wasn't able to land a hit in the Manga as well. Doesn't change the fact that they're said to be equal in the Daiz.

It means that he wasn't mentioned to have used it. That's it. Prior to later Daizenshuus coming out there wasn't any proof that he was, but now there is.

An asspull if I've ever seen one. The story was finished when the Daizenshuu were published. There was no new information regarding proof of Gohan's form. It's simply the Story Guide and the Character Bios giving two different outcomes of what took place. One says he's a Super Saiyan 2, the other says he never used one beyond Vol.37. The Dragon Books even says Gohan was only a Super Saiyan when he fought Dabra, and that was released well after the Daizenshuu.

So yeah, there's contradictions among all of these official guides. All of them aren't correct. Stop.

You think that was shown, it was stated otherwise. You can remain in denial if you want though.

Lol, if anyone's being in denial, it's you. Gohan was shown to be stronger. It was stated otherwise in the story? Please tell me what chapter this took place on.

Just means that Gohan cares about Piccolo. He wasn't giving orders as his superior. Gohan used some power, but didn't truly put his mind into it, otherwise he wouldn't only be able to use it momentarily. The owners of Dragon Ball already clarified the situation. Your points are moot based on that alone.

As if you're in a position to clarify how Gohan's power works. An enraged Gohan is stronger than a Gohan that isn't enraged. Proof? The Raditz saga, Saiyan saga, Freeza saga, Cell saga. You know, something that's plainly obvious. Gohan not only was determined to protect Piccolo, but his rage took over and allowed him to knock Nappa away when he got near him. So yes, all of that baseless conjecture you mentioned is just that.

Not seeing how this is a relevant question.

You said anything with AT's name on it is considered official. Therefore, are the bios of Budokai Tenkaichi 3 canon? It's a simple question.

The Daizenshuu lists Gohan's power lower than Piccolo's, hence he didn't. Easy.

The story shows Gohan>Piccolo, hence he did. Easy. Story>Daizenshuu. Guess which one AT wrote? Yeah, that.

Black wins because he's basically a better version of Goku. Their power was stated to be a match, so when was it shown to be a match? After Black first unlocked Rose. Not seeing why it's so hard to put two and two together. Probably the bias.

Yeah, except Black had the upperhand the entire time when they clashed in those forms. The only time they were match is when Black fought Super Saiyan 2 Goku. That's it. Yeah, I'm not understanding what's so hard to understand that Black is superior to Goku.

Goten and Trunks are not part of the top 10 strongest people on earth as stated by Toei. Their inexperience and recklessness is irrelevant to their power. The only thing they possess is power and they wield it recklessly.

Which means next to nothing to being the strongest. Goku said they weren't excluded for their power. If a balanced Krillin fought an unbalanced Kid Trunks, Krillin would get his ass plowed because he's weaker. Nothing more needs to be said.

Everyone on the team is better balanced overall on top of being stronger because as stated, they are the 10 strongest people on earth. Not hard to understand at all. Don't know what the obsession with inflating Goten and Trunks to absurd levels is about.

None of which has anything to do with Krillin and Roshi being stronger than the kids. More drivel on your end. And the Super Saiyan kids being superior to Krillin and Roshi is inflating now? You really are a strange one.

 

[supersaiyangodgogeta]

Gohan did put his mind to it and proceeded to get enraged on top of that. Enraged Gohan>Gohan in general. Therefore, Gohan>Piccolo. Something actually displayed in the story.

The official interpretation disagrees with yours so nah.

Using this ridiculous logic, Roshi, Tien, and Krillin were also stronger than the kids back during the Boo saga as well.

And the kids weren't selected because they were inexperienced. Goku flat-out said their power wasn't the issue.

No, their power isn't an issue. They still aren't one of the 10 strongest on earth as stated by Toei. Not hard to understand.

Yes, my logic even though your infallible Daiz says Goten=Gohan. One which requires you to throw in your own spin to make the bio logical.

Pretty sure Goten wasn't able to land a hit in the Manga as well. Doesn't change the fact that they're said to be equal in the Daiz.

Yes, your logic says that Ultimate Gohan=Goten since you said yourself that the Daizenshuu makes no distinction between the different Gohans. So we get Goten=Gohan>Gotenks. The versions that are equal are the ones that were shown fighting equally. That doesn't contradict the Daizenshuu.
No, their equal spar happens before Goten trying to hit Gohan and failing every time.

An asspull if I've ever seen one. The story was finished when the Daizenshuu were published. There was no new information regarding proof of Gohan's form. It's simply the Story Guide and the Character Bios giving two different outcomes of what took place. One says he's a Super Saiyan 2, the other says he never used one beyond Vol.37. The Dragon Books even says Gohan was only a Super Saiyan when he fought Dabra, and that was released well after the Daizenshuu.

So yeah, there's contradictions among all of these official guides. All of them aren't correct. Stop.

One guide doesn't explicitly say that he doesn't use it, but makes no mention of him using it. The other specifically states that he used it.
As far as the Dragon Book is concerned, I'm going to need the translation. If it says something like, "he was a Super Saiyan when he fought Dabura", sources have used the blanket term "Super Saiyan" for all Super Saiyan forms.

I'm sure the official preview for the Goku vs Zamasu episode simply stated that Goku fights him as a Super Saiyan, even though he was a Super Saiyan 2.

Lol, if anyone's being in denial, it's you. Gohan was shown to be stronger. It was stated otherwise in the story? Please tell me what chapter this took place on.

It was stated in the series by an official source that was created to give clarity to the story, therefore it's interpretation>Yours. It's really that simple.

As if you're in a position to clarify how Gohan's power works. An enraged Gohan is stronger than a Gohan that isn't enraged. Proof? The Raditz saga, Saiyan saga, Freeza saga, Cell saga. You know, something that's plainly obvious. Gohan not only was determined to protect Piccolo, but his rage took over and allowed him to knock Nappa away when he got near him. So yes, all of that baseless conjecture you mentioned is just that.

Not baseless conjecture. The Daizenshuu clarifies that me interpretation is the correct one over yours.

You said anything with AT's name on it is considered official. Therefore, are the bios of Budokai Tenkaichi 3 canon? It's a simple question.

I didn't say that, so once again, irrelevant question.

The story shows Gohan>Piccolo, hence he did. Easy. Story>Daizenshuu. Guess which one AT wrote? Yeah, that.

Nah, the Daizenshuu and the story are the same. Daizenshuu>Your interpretation of the story. You need to accept that your interpretation is nothing more than your interpretation.

Yeah, except Black had the upperhand the entire time when they clashed in those forms. The only time they were match is when Black fought Super Saiyan 2 Goku. That's it. Yeah, I'm not understanding what's so hard to understand that Black is superior to Goku.

On pure power terms they were a match in Blue and Rose as stated by Toei. Black was superior because overall, he was better than Goku. Yeah, this isn't hard to understand.

Which means next to nothing to being the strongest. Goku said they weren't excluded for their power. If a balanced Krillin fought an unbalanced Kid Trunks, Krillin would get his ass plowed because he's weaker. Nothing more needs to be said.

None of which has anything to do with Krillin and Roshi being stronger than the kids. More drivel on your end. And the Super Saiyan kids being superior to Krillin and Roshi is inflating now? You really are a strange one.

As stated by Toei, Goku, Vegeta, Gohan, Majin Boo, #17, #18, Piccolo, Krillin, Tien and Roshi are the ten strongest people on earth. I don't know why this is such a hard concept to grasp.
No, their power wasn't an issue, their experience was. They still aren't stronger than anyone that's participating because as stated, the people on the U7 team are the strongest.

No, if Krillin fought Trunks, Trunks would get demolished because as stated by Toei, Krillin is stronger.