Cell Arc Inconsistency/Bad Writing thread

[Captain Cadaver]

Since we have one for the Boo Arc, then why not for the even worse Cell Arc? :mikey

Just to start off...

- #19 and #20 being the Artificial Humans Trunks mentioned being retconned.
- Gero never expecting Goku to make major gains after the Saiyan Arc and saying so even after having taken a full power punch from a Base Goku hundreds of times stronger than anything Saiyan Arc Goku could dish out.
- Present #17 and #18 being stronger and far different in personality from their Trunks timeline selves for no real reason other than "hurr durr we altered the timeline".
- Cell's timeline in general, such as Trunks killing Freeza or the Time Machine being set 1 year before Freeza's arrival and Trunks supposedly going to that time to tell everyone he succeeded in defeating #17 and #18.
- Cell being surprised Piccolo regenerated his arm when he was the very person Cell inherited the ability from.
- The Rosat having never been brought up prior, despite having been worth a shot during the Saiyan Arc or even for the 3 year training.
- Tenshinhan having a technique that could restrain 2nd form Cell, yet never using it against #17.
- Cell regenerating from Goku's Kamehameha, despite what he said when explaining his regeneration later.

And now poor character writing deserves its own category:

- Yamcha received very poor character assassination. The loyal boyfriend of an unfaithful woman being rewritten as a cheat was just a lazy way to make Bulma x Vegeta happen without Bulma being irredeemable.
- Goku would stop anyone from harming his friends in previous arcs, yet doesn't stop Gero when he had the chance right after returning to Earth. The excuse of him having done nothing yet made no sense when his trajectory was inevitable and at the very least they could've wrecked his lab without harming Gero.
- Vegeta went through major character regression, going from someone who entrusted his Saiyan Pride with Goku and hoping he became a Super Saiyan to just going on about "muh pride" and wanting to surpass Goku, not to mention there was no justification for him letting Cell transform compared to his far more logical case with Freeza.
- Despite being the time traveller, Trunks had to rely on 9 year old Gohan to figure out basic matters of time travel's multiverse effect during the plane ride.
- Gohan was fine killing a Freeza Soldier on Namek, yet becomes completely pacifistic when fighting Cell.

 

[Victorious]

Cell's timeline is not inconsistent, its just fucking weird..and necessitates a 4th timeline.

Why can't the present Androids be far stronger for the simple reason Goku was alive and Gero being conscious of Goku's existence? Perhaps in the Future Trunks timeline Gero got the news of Goku's death so didn't make #17 and #18 nearly as powerful?

I do think the Tien Shin Kikoho hax was unneeded though. Surely they could have found some other way to have #18 escape without needing Tien. If they just had her leave 5 the scene 5 minutes earlier we wouldn't have needed Ten's heroism. But #16 probably would have been killed.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

Cell's timeline is not inconsistent, its just fucking weird..and necessitates a 4th timeline.

It is given no explanation as to why the differences occur, therefore it's inconsistent.

Why can't the present Androids be far stronger for the simple reason Goku was alive and Gero being conscious of Goku's existence? Perhaps in the Future Trunks timeline Gero got the news of Goku's death so didn't make #17 and #18 nearly as powerful?

1. That's a major assumption with no evidence backing it up. Also, Cell implying the #17 and #18 of his timeline were as strong as the present ones outright contradicts that.
2. There is no pivotal change in the timeline that would directly lead to #17 and #18's power and, more importantly, their personalities being completely different. It's just Toriyama using the excuse of timelines being changed to throw any consistency in continuity out the window.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

Despite being the time traveller, Trunks had to rely on 9 year old Gohan to figure out basic matters o

Gohan is genius bruh.

Anyway, I don't think there's anything I can add on this topic. You've covered them all.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

Gohan is genius bruh.

His Future self must've been lazy in not helping build the time machine with his genius level intellect 2

---

A few more...

- Vegeta knew that the Ginyus were in the middle of taking over Yardrat, despite having been absent from intel on the Freeza Force's movements for over a year.
- Not only Goku's reasons for not stopping Gero immediately are dumb, but those of the rest of the cast. The excuse of testing themselves as a martial artist that Ten gives is stupid when he had no problem resorting to the Mafuba against Daimao. It's also made inconsistent later on when the group have no problem attempting to destroy #17 and #18 before they're activated and even more obvious, actually killing the Present Cell when in his foetus stage. Basically, despite how much of an asinine character rewrite Vegeta had in letting Cell achieve perfection, the entire cast bar Bulma are doing the exact same in this situation.
- Goku having the Senzu bag in one panel only to lose them in the next is rewritten as him leaving them where the group met up, despite them being of no use so far from the battle.
- Gero's radar is heavily inconsistent. Despite his scientific genius, he seems completely off when analysing Goku and Vegeta even after they power up. For some reason, his radar also seems to have far less range than #16's.
- Trunks brings the "Age" system for the Dragon World's Calendar, despite it being in the same world as Dr. Slump which uses the Gregorian Calendar.
- Piccolo's reaction to Cell knowing the Kamehameha is very over the top when it's been shown time and again to be one of the easiest signature Ki techniques to replicate.
- Cell says his present self won't mature for another 24 years, despite that being inconsistent with Future Trunks being 20 at this point and 23 when he killed Future Cell.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

His Future self must've been lazy in not helping build the time machine with his genius level intellect

Does Future Gohan even now about Bulma's plan on timemachine? I don't think they planned that after Gohan died.

 

[sei'taer]

I'm convinced no one knows what a plot hole is anymore.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

I'm convinced no one knows what a plot hole is anymore.

I'm convinced you misread the title.

This thread isn't just for plot holes (of which this arc has many), but also general inconsistencies, contrivances and other questionable additions to the arc's writing.

 

[Victorious]

CC

The Androids in Cell's timeline are equal to the present Androids because Trunks kills Freeza in Cell's timeline..assumingly he also gives Goku the medicine and Goku lives longer. So I see no contradiction.

 

[ahill1]

The Androids in Cell's timeline are equal to the present Androids because Trunks kills Freeza in Cell's timeline..assumingly he also gives Goku the medicine and Goku lives longer. So I see no contradiction.

If that were the case (Gero making the androids stronger due to Goku being alive), why did he opted attacking the Z warriors with himself and #19, who are far weaker than the future androids? The fact that he believed there was no logical reason for Goku to surpass himself and the fat android ought to mean the androids in the present weren't stronger simply because Goku lived.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

The Androids in Cell's timeline are equal to the present Androids because Trunks kills Freeza in Cell's timeline..assumingly he also gives Goku the medicine and Goku lives longer. So I see no contradiction.

That is never explained as a reason and is therefore just a baseless assumption, especially the latter half of your post. Even if it wasn't, Trunks killing Freeza has no direct correlation with Gero's research, so having it affect the timeline through such a flimsy excuse as the butterfly effect would be bad writing nonetheless.

 

[withheldforprivacy]

-Androids are introduced as formidable. When they have lived up to the expectations, one shotting Z fighters, AT,
for no apparent reason, writes Trunks saying 'no, they were not that formidable; actually, I could fight them evenly',
a line that is seemingly totally forgotten afterward and even kinda retconned at Lone Warrior saga when Trunks can't
do shit against them.

-Gohan dreams about Perfect Cell in the spirit room despite never having seen him.

 

[Victorious]

CC well its certainly is an assumption but it's not baseless. I think it makes a lot of sense. Also how can you say Gero's research has no correlation to Trunks killing Freeza as it was said by Cell the spy robot took Freeza and Cold cells when Trunks killed them, and didn't bother with Trunks cause they had enough Saiyans.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

-Gohan dreams about Perfect Cell in the spirit room despite never having seen him.

That was filler.

CC well its certainly is an assumption but it's not baseless. I think it makes a lot of sense. Also how can you say Gero's research has no correlation to Trunks killing Freeza as it was said by Cell the spy robot took Freeza and Cold cells when Trunks killed them, and didn't bother with Trunks cause they had enough Saiyans.

The Spy-Robot was part of what had been made a side project completely disconnected from the main project of the numbered Artificial Humans. Also, if that was indeed an addition to Gero's primary research (which it clearly isn't when the plot goes out of the way to say Cell became a side project), it would create an equally big inconsistency in how Gero knew nothing about Super Saiyans when collecting data from Freeza and Cold would naturally result in him learning about it in any of the timelines.

 

[Pocket-Gog~]

Since we have one for the Boo Arc, then why not for the even worse Cell Arc? :mikey

What about one for the Freeza arc?

 

[Papasmurf]

That'd be boring since 90% of the inconsistencies would be bullshit zenkais and transformation boosts from the Freeza fight lol

 

[Victorious]

-Gohan dreams about Perfect Cell in the spirit room despite never having seen him.

That was filler.

CC well its certainly is an assumption but it's not baseless. I think it makes a lot of sense. Also how can you say Gero's research has no correlation to Trunks killing Freeza as it was said by Cell the spy robot took Freeza and Cold cells when Trunks killed them, and didn't bother with Trunks cause they had enough Saiyans.

The Spy-Robot was part of what had been made a side project completely disconnected from the main project of the numbered Artificial Humans. Also, if that was indeed an addition to Gero's primary research (which it clearly isn't when the plot goes out of the way to say Cell became a side project), it would create an equally big inconsistency in how Gero knew nothing about Super Saiyans when collecting data from Freeza and Cold would naturally result in him learning about it in any of the timelines.

Well that is true, Gero does not know about Super Saiyans. Only Kaioken

It seems that it is mostly an Artificial Intelligence that works on Cell.."Gero's Supercomputer" . Gero started the project but the Supercomputer finished it.


But anyway, i still think there is a link between Trunks killing Freeza, [more so with Goku getting an antidote from Trunks], Goku living longer, and the general power of the Androids. To say it's just random doesnt make much sense because a lot of events in Cell's timeline mirror the main timeline. [accept for Cell showing up]. And the Androids power being equal to the main timeline Androids makes sense. It would make less sense for the Androids in Cell's timeline to be as weak as the ones in the Future Trunks timeline.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

But anyway, i still think there is a link between Trunks killing Freeza, [more so with Goku getting an antidote from Trunks], Goku living longer, and the general power of the Androids. To say it's just random doesnt make much sense because a lot of events in Cell's timeline mirror the main timeline. [accept for Cell showing up]. And the Androids power being equal to the main timeline Androids makes sense. It would make less sense for the Androids in Cell's timeline to be as weak as the ones in the Future Trunks timeline.

Except that there's no logical correlation between any of the events leading up to the change in #17/18's strength and more importantly, their personality difference. There's no reason for Gero to limit their strength or alter their personalities in Trunks' timeline if not only was Goku's death the main cause, but he stopped collecting data on Goku after the Saiyan Arc.

There were indeed work arounds that could explain this. For instance, suppose Goku used the Dragon Balls to locate Gero just after the Mecha Freeza fight and warn him of what's to come. Gero would then have current data to make #17 and #18 stronger as well as moving his lab meaning the Z-Warriors can't relocate him and would offer a logical reason for the time travel changes.
Unfortunately, that's just fan-fiction and what we got was Toriyama not providing a concise series of events and forcing fans to grasp at straws to make sense of the whole thing.

 

[SIAD]

I'm pretty sure Goku is the one who kills Frieza in the Cell Timeline. Cell (Post Jinger) only knows that the Androids of his Line are stronger than his current I, not necessarily as strong as the Androids of the Main Line.

 If a Future Trunks had killed Frieza in the Cell Line, then he would have given the medicine to Goku and everyone would have trained just like in the Main Line. If that had been the case, Cell when he saw Vegeta for the first time on the Main Timeline, he would not have said "Vegeta is still alive, he has also become very strong". Therefore, Vegeta of the Cell Line is not as powerful as the Vegeta of the Main Line.

 When Cell reveals his identity to Piccolo in the Manga, they only show images of the death of Frieza and King Cold, it was more like a copy and paste the images when they had been killed by Future Trunks. Then Cell says he could get Cells from a Warrior named Trunks, but that does not mean he necessarily referred to the same time that Freezer and King Cold had been killed.

 In the Anime, it must have been a mistake to show Future Trunks killing Frieza and King Cold in the Cell Timeline. It must have been again a copy and paste that scene. It was a possible plot error.

I think the Future Trunks and Cell lines were identical, but with the difference is that in the Future Trunks Line, this was strengthened in the past and could kill Cell, while in the other Line did not happen the same.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

Trunks killing Freeza is shown in Cell's explanation in the manga too, so it's not anime-exclusive. You could try to make sense of it by assuming Cell sensed Trunks when in his larval state, but that's dubious at best when logically, he shouldn't have been able to do so in a hibernative state, plus none of this would solve the problem of Trunks' Time Machine being programmed for one year earlier to supposedly inform the Z-Warriors of his victory at a time when they'd have no idea who he was.