Current Roshi vs Kids

[Captain Cadaver]

SSJ3 Gotenks > Piccolo

Piccolo >> U6 Arc Base Goku/Vegeta >>> SS3 Gotenks though. His performance against Ultimate Gohan doesn't mean much either. At that point, Piccolo had already divided himself into multiple clones, which is known to divide one's power.

 

[Animelover5487]

SSJ3 Gotenks > Piccolo

Piccolo >> U6 Arc Base Goku/Vegeta >>> SS3 Gotenks though. His performance against Ultimate Gohan doesn't mean much either.

Manga-wise maybe but going by the anime Piccolo doesn't have to be stronger than U6 Base Goku. He performed well against Frost due to tactics, cunning, and technique.

At that point, Piccolo had already divided himself into multiple clones, which is known to divide one's power.

I don't think Piccolo's clones work the same way Ten's do. They may not be as strong as the original but the intent of having Gohan accidentally slice Piccolo's arm off seemed to me to show how much stronger Gohan is then Piccolo but despite all of his power he is too cocky making him vulnerable to off guard attacks.

 

[xmysticgohanx]

That chain is all out of whack
Kulilin > base Goku > base Gohan >>> u6 arc base saiyans >>> SSJ3 Gotenks
Even RoF SSJ Gohan is > SSJ Gotenks
Gotenks, any by extension Z power levels, are nothing in Super

That would completely contradict everything regarding Gohan regaining the power he had against Boo during the episode in which he was training with Piccolo, which is treated with far more plot/character relevance than the filler-esque sparring match he had against Goku. The same Gohan who couldn't match such power with SS2 could overpower Kuririn in his Base form.

Ultimate Gohan (Boo) > SS2 Gohan (Zen Exhibition) >>> Base Gohan (Zen Exhibition) >/>> Kuririn is basically a fact. I agree that Kuririn is far stronger than before, but not to that contradictory extent. His performance against SSJ Goku was likely the writers just emphasising the importance of tactics in the Tournament of Power.

It's that episode that is "wrong", at least face value anyway. The episode was spent getting gohan to his former power. However, as we seen from:

1. the feats Gohan performed vs Piccolo, who is far above ultimate Gohan

2. the feats a far weaker SSJ Gohan did vs Tagoma, when compared to SSJ Gotenks

3. the feats Gohan performed vs Goku, a couple episodes later. (this one isn't as good as a proof because Gohan and Piccolo trained after Gohan got his ultimate back)

We can make the reasonable conclusion that the episode just meant his ultimate state rather than the actual power he had

 

[Captain Cadaver]

It's that episode that is "wrong", at least face value anyway. The episode was spent getting gohan to his former power. However, as we seen from:

1. the feats Gohan performed vs Piccolo, who is far above ultimate Gohan

2. the feats a far weaker SSJ Gohan did vs Tagoma, when compared to SSJ Gotenks

3. the feats Gohan performed vs Goku, a couple episodes later. (this one isn't as good as a proof because Gohan and Piccolo trained after Gohan got his ultimate back)

We can make the reasonable conclusion that the episode just meant his ultimate state rather than the actual power he had

1. That can be chalked up to Piccolo's clones' power working much like the Shishin no Ken, in other words, diving his power.

2. Irrelevant, considering SSJ Gotenks is still far inferior to Ultimate Gohan. Gohan's hair also suggests he was a SS2 at that point.

3. As you even said, that evidence is shaky at best and likely as qualifiable as most contradictive DBZ filler.

The way Piccolo talked about whipping Gohan into shape and about his power against Boo in general definitely seems to suggest he wanted to have Gohan retain his old power, rather than just the form itself. Ultimate's main benefit beyond just training his SSJ forms is better stamina, hardly enough of an asset if that was purely what their 2 days worth of training was to work towards.

The statements surrounding the episodes definitely point to Gohan regaining his Boo Arc power rather than just the form, whereas most of the feats can be chalked up to typical Toei nonsense.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

Episode: 88
Time: 09:24-10:49
Context: Piccolo tells Gohan what he was doing wrong and gives him a confidence
Piccolo: "I see nothing but overeagerness. You won't get anything done like that. Training much less getting stronger. If you can't even evoke your original strength, you'll never be able to protect your family! It's true, the wish to protect can give you strength. But, wishing too strongly can be dangerous. If you can't control it properly, it will impede more than benefit. If you obsess with winning, you can't calmly assess the situation, and you'll misjudge an enemy's true strength."
Gohan: "I see... I couldn't even recognize that..."
Piccolo: "No fight is assured victory! If you lose, this universe will be erased. First accept that fact! And then win!"
Gohan: "Yes!"
Piccolo: "Don't worry. You can win. I'm the one telling you this. Have some confidence."
Gohan: "Piccolo san. Thank you very much!"

Episode: 88
Time: 16:54-18:00
Context: Gohan powers up to Super Saiyan to beyond his limits
Piccolo: "Super Saiyan isn't your full power, is it? That power you used when you fought Buu... Awaken that real you!"
*After Gohan surpassed his limits*
Gohan: "Piccolo san, I won't be holding back."
Piccolo: "Bring it on."

Episode: 89
Time: 02:02-02:34
Context: Gohan is once again Ultimate
Narrator: "By overcoming the weakness that Piccolo pointed out, Gohan was able to get back his original power. [] Gohan was aiming for greater heights with Piccolo."

 

[xmysticgohanx]

It's that episode that is "wrong", at least face value anyway. The episode was spent getting gohan to his former power. However, as we seen from:

1. the feats Gohan performed vs Piccolo, who is far above ultimate Gohan

2. the feats a far weaker SSJ Gohan did vs Tagoma, when compared to SSJ Gotenks

3. the feats Gohan performed vs Goku, a couple episodes later. (this one isn't as good as a proof because Gohan and Piccolo trained after Gohan got his ultimate back)

We can make the reasonable conclusion that the episode just meant his ultimate state rather than the actual power he had

1. That can be chalked up to Piccolo's clones' power working much like the Shishin no Ken, in other words, diving his power.

2. Irrelevant, considering SSJ Gotenks is still far inferior to Ultimate Gohan. Gohan's hair also suggests he was a SS2 at that point.

3. As you even said, that evidence is shaky at best and likely as qualifiable as most contradictive DBZ filler.

The way Piccolo talked about whipping Gohan into shape and about his power against Boo in general definitely seems to suggest he wanted to have Gohan retain his old power, rather than just the form itself. Ultimate's main benefit beyond just training his SSJ forms is better stamina, hardly enough of an asset if that was purely what their 2 days worth of training was to work towards.

The statements surrounding the episodes definitely point to Gohan regaining his Boo Arc power rather than just the form, whereas most of the feats can be chalked up to typical Toei nonsense.

I forgot to mention that Tagoma was said to be comparable to prime Gohan

We're going to have to agree to disagree here.

 

[Future Warrior]

I forgot to mention that Tagoma was said to be comparable to prime Gohan

He never said he was as strong as his prime, that was a fanslation error.

 

[xmysticgohanx]

Dragon team v2 has comparable to my max or something like that

There is no reason for them be scared of him if they're talking about Gohan's current max

 

[Future Warrior]

Dragon team v2 has comparable to my max or something like that

There is no reason for them be scared of him if they're talking about Gohan's current max

Cause SS Gohan was the strongest among them. Plus he was unsure if he was able to go SS at that point.

Also, going by your logic why would he call his Boo arc self his max if his current self is stronger than that as a Super Saiyan?

 

[xmysticgohanx]

Dragon team v2 has comparable to my max or something like that

There is no reason for them be scared of him if they're talking about Gohan's current max

Cause SS Gohan was the strongest among them. Plus he was unsure if he was able to go SS at that point.

Also, going by your logic why would he call his Boo arc self his max if his current self is stronger than that as a Super Saiyan?

Actually hold up now that i think about it, the only options that make sense is if Gohan was talking about either his boo arc power or what he thinks is his current power and not realizing his current power is higher

If he was talking about his current power, then it makes no sense for Gohan to be able to compete with Ginyu (Tagoma) who is stronger than Tagoma unless Gohan incorrectly assessed his own power.

If he was talking about his ultimate power, then Gohan's current is higher and Gohan though his ultimate was still stronger.

Also, base Gohan did far better than Piccolo. Only ultimate gohan and maybe Z sword Gohan would be able to do the same (I'm going to need a power level list to know for sure though)