M10 LSSj Broly's power

[Papasmurf]

I was tempted to rewatch portions of M10 to participate but it was too shit to watch

 

[Spiral-Force]

Based on his feats, and the SSJ2 Goku > LSSJ Broly implication at the end of M11, I wouldn't put him any higher than Super Perfect Cell.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

Because it still happened? This film takes place directly after the 7 year gap, so why would he refer to anything but when he was relevant?

He was referring his power level against Broly on M8 whether he was relevant or not.

 

[Six Trails]

Why the heck would Gohan be referring to any other time period than Movie 8? He didn't say that he was stronger than he was seven years ago, he said that he'd powered up considerably since then (then being the last time he saw Broly).

 

[Jeff Styles]

Going by M11 and M12, I put Broly at least Pre Majin Vegeta level to at most SPC level.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

Based on his feats, and the SSJ2 Goku > LSSJ Broly implication at the end of M11, I wouldn't put him any higher than Super Perfect Cell.

Well Goku doesn't know how strong Broly have become.

 

[Spiral-Force]

Based on his feats, and the SSJ2 Goku > LSSJ Broly implication at the end of M11, I wouldn't put him any higher than Super Perfect Cell.

Well Goku doesn't know how strong Broly have become.

Perhaps, but Goku & Pikkon were sent to defeat Broly at the end of M11, and the former being present in M12 suggests that the mission was a success. Pikkon is a good deal weaker than Goku, so I doubt he did anything worthwhile.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

Based on his feats, and the SSJ2 Goku > LSSJ Broly implication at the end of M11, I wouldn't put him any higher than Super Perfect Cell.

Well Goku doesn't know how strong Broly have become.

Perhaps, but Goku & Pikkon were sent to defeat Broly at the end of M11, and the former being present in M12 suggests that the mission was a success. Pikkon is a good deal weaker than Goku, so I doubt he did anything worthwhile.

Or he could have beat him as SSj3.

 

[Spiral-Force]

Well Goku doesn't know how strong Broly have become.

Perhaps, but Goku & Pikkon were sent to defeat Broly at the end of M11, and the former being present in M12 suggests that the mission was a success. Pikkon is a good deal weaker than Goku, so I doubt he did anything worthwhile.

Or he could have beat him as SSj3.

Why would SSJ3 Goku be required to defeat someone that struggled to maintain dominance over a weak and rusty SSJ2 Gohan?

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

Perhaps, but Goku & Pikkon were sent to defeat Broly at the end of M11, and the former being present in M12 suggests that the mission was a success. Pikkon is a good deal weaker than Goku, so I doubt he did anything worthwhile.

Or he could have beat him as SSj3.

Why would SSJ3 Goku be required to defeat someone that struggled to maintain dominance over a weak and rusty SSJ2 Gohan?

M10 implied that Gohan cannot beat Broly and resorted to drown him into the lava despite their fight suggest and that's Toei's inconsistencies similar to Vegeta/Janemba where SSj3 Goku can't beat and Vegeta managed to held himself. If Goku's SSj2 can't beat Broly then why not use SSj3? Either way, this is just speculation anyway as if Toei gives a damn whether how Goku beat Broly.

 

[Spiral-Force]

M10 implied that Gohan cannot beat Broly and resorted to drown him into the lava despite their fight suggest and that's Toei's inconsistencies similar to Vegeta/Janemba where SSj3 Goku can't beat and Vegeta managed to held himself.

Janemba was smiling and toying around with Goku and Vegeta, Broly on the other hand looked pretty serious and frustrated for most of his fight with Gohan. Against Broly, Gohan got some decent hits in, he outmuscled him, outpaced him, and beat him with the help of SSJ Goten.

If Goku's SSj2 can't beat Broly then why not use SSj3? Either way, this is just speculation anyway as if Toei gives a damn whether how Goku beat Broly.

Why can't SSJ2 Goku beat Broly? Considering the latter's feats, there's nothing wrong with thinking: SSJ2 Goku > LSSJ Broly.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

M10 implied that Gohan cannot beat Broly and resorted to drown him into the lava despite their fight suggest and that's Toei's inconsistencies similar to Vegeta/Janemba where SSj3 Goku can't beat and Vegeta managed to held himself.

Janemba was smiling and toying around with Goku and Vegeta, Broly on the other hand looked pretty serious and frustrated for most of his fight with Gohan. Against Broly, Gohan got some decent hits in, he outmuscled him, outpaced him, and beat him with the help of SSJ Goten.

If Goku's SSj2 can't beat Broly then why not use SSj3? Either way, this is just speculation anyway as if Toei gives a damn whether how Goku beat Broly.

Why can't SSJ2 Goku beat Broly? Considering the latter's feats, there's nothing wrong with thinking: SSJ2 Goku > LSSJ Broly.

No, Broly was smiling and laughing the whole time until Gohan managed to escape from him. Janemba on the other hand either toying or not doesn't contradict anything because that's just part of Toei's inconsistencies and both Super and DBZ anime suffered that way especially GT.

Feats doesn't mean anything in Toei's world and we must follow the statements only. Daizenshuu states that Broly surpass Goku so that's it.

 

[Spiral-Force]

No, Broly was smiling and laughing the whole time until Gohan managed to escape from him.

I was referring to LSSJ Broly and SSJ2 Gohan's fight, pre-lava. Regardless, you can't disregard the points of the fight in which Broly showed frustration, got outmuscled, and got outpaced.

Janemba on the other hand either toying or not doesn't contradict anything because that's just part of Toei's inconsistencies and both Super and DBZ anime suffered that way especially GT.

I didn't say it did. You were the one that brought up Janemba in the first place.

Feats doesn't mean anything in Toei's world and we must follow the statements only. Daizenshuu states that Broly surpass Goku so that's it.

Feats imply or reinforce how strong a character is, a few explainable anomalies doesn't mean that they should never be used to determine a character's strength. Anyway, the statement that your referring to is under Broly's Super Saiyan sub-heading, implying that SSJ Broly > SSJ Goku. That doesn't speak volumes about the two at their strongest though.

 

[SSJ2]

I'll reply to this today @Mike

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

I was referring to LSSJ Broly and SSJ2 Gohan's fight, pre-lava. Regardless, you can't disregard the points of the fight in which Broly showed frustration, got outmuscled, and got outpaced.

No, he didn't. Gohan was owned in that fight and managed to lay 2 hits and that's it, Broly pretty much tanked Gohan's punch and kicks after that locked him back. And also Broly was smiling the whole time until Gohan managed to escaped from him.
[youtube]X913eWgbSOk[/youtube]

I didn't say it did. You were the one that brought up Janemba in the first place.

I brought it up to show how inconsistent the fight is despite their gap suggest.

Feats imply or reinforce how strong a character is, a few explainable anomalies doesn't mean that they should never be used to determine a character's strength. Anyway, the statement that your referring to is under Broly's Super Saiyan sub-heading, implying that SSJ Broly > SSJ Goku. That doesn't speak volumes about the two at their strongest though.

Not in the Toei world lol.

Either way, Broly handled Gohan easily which suggest that he's above than him by a wide margin.

 

[Spiral-Force]

No, he didn't. Gohan was owned in that fight and managed to lay 2 hits and that's it, Broly pretty much tanked Gohan's punch and kicks after that locked him back. And also Broly was smiling the whole time until Gohan managed to escaped from him.
[youtube]X913eWgbSOk[/youtube]

Broly's tanking feat is shaky at best when you consider that he couldn't tank Gohan's kick at 1:07, or at 1:09, or at 1:50 (after getting outmuscled). Regardless, tanking doesn't have to mean that the gap is as huge as you're making it out to be, considering that Piccolo Jr tanked Goku's Kamehameha, despite being slightly weaker than Goku. At the end of the day, Broly didn't do anything that SPC couldn't do, so putting Broly above him isn't necessary.

I brought it up to show how inconsistent the fight is despite their gap suggest.

Your comparison has negative correlation, as Janemba was obviously toying with Goku & Vegeta, unless you're implying SSJ2 Vegeta ~ SSJ3 Goku, even though it was indicated: Goku >> Vegeta in the movie.

Not in the Toei world lol.

Either way, Broly handled Gohan easily which suggest that he's above than him by a wide margin.

The margin is significant, but again, Broly didn't do anything that SPC couldn't do, so I have no reason to put him above that level.

Also, perhaps you didn't notice, but your "feats don't mean anything in Toei world" argument is contradicted by you using Broly's/Gohan's FEATS to suggest how strong they are...

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

Broly's tanking feat is shaky at best when you consider that he couldn't tank Gohan's kick at 1:07, or at 1:09, or at 1:50 (after getting outmuscled). Regardless, tanking doesn't have to mean that the gap is as huge as you're making it out to be, considering that Piccolo Jr tanked Goku's Kamehameha, despite being slightly weaker than Goku. At the end of the day, Broly didn't do anything that SPC couldn't do, so putting Broly above him isn't necessary.

So now you agree that it is inconsistency on Toei's part.

Your comparison has negative correlation, as Janemba was obviously toying with Goku & Vegeta, unless you're implying SSJ2 Vegeta ~ SSJ3 Goku, even though it was indicated: Goku >> Vegeta in the movie.

It's not that he was toying, what i'm saying is that it is inconsistency so its baseless if you use it as your argument.

The margin is significant, but again, Broly didn't do anything that SPC couldn't do, so I have no reason to put him above that level.

Also, perhaps you didn't notice, but your "feats don't mean anything in Toei world" argument is contradicted by you using Broly's/Gohan's FEATS to suggest how strong they are...

SPC didn't do anything except he killed Trunks and nearly Vegeta. Broly on the other hand nearly destroy Goku, Gohan and Goten whether Goku was SSJ/2 is debatable.You're the one who was using their fight to determine their gap which i suggested you not to because of its inconsistency but later used it to prove that their gap is huge because of those tanking feats but then again, this is Toei.

 

[Spiral-Force]

So now you agree that it is inconsistency on Toei's part.

When did I ever disagree? You're the one that's using Broly's tanking feat to suggest a "wide" gap.

It's not that he was toying, what i'm saying is that it is inconsistency so its baseless if you use it as your argument.

What was inconsistent in Janemba's case?

SPC didn't do anything except he killed Trunks and nearly Vegeta.

He also injured SSJ2 Kid Gohan's arm. Additionally, he is implied to rival SSJ2 Kid Gohan, and would've put up better resistance against the latter's full power Kamehameha if he wasn't caught off guard.

Broly on the other hand nearly destroy Goku, Gohan and Goten whether Goku was SSJ/2 is debatable.

It can be argued that Goku wasn't physically present during the beam struggle, but was merely giving mental support, like in Gohan's final beam struggle with Cell.

You're the one who was using their fight to determine their gap which i suggested you not to because of its inconsistency but later used it to prove that their gap is huge because of those tanking feats but then again, this is Toei.

When did I say that the gap between Gohan & Broly is huge because of Broly's tanking feat? You're just needlessly and inaccurately overcomplicating things.

 

[Tapion]

Either way you look at it, Broly didn't do anything SSj2 Goku couldn't. He is Good-Boo level at most and SSj2 Vegeta Pre majin at least imo.

 

[Let's Go Fearless!]

When did I ever disagree? You're the one that's using Broly's tanking feat to suggest a "wide" gap.

You claimed that Broly/Gohan gap is small because of their fight which I respond that its just inconsistent but if we use their fight to determine their gap then the gap would be big.

What was inconsistent in Janemba's case?

That Vegeta was able to put a good fight against him despite being a SSj2 tier while Janemba is a SSJ3 tier?

He also injured SSJ2 Kid Gohan's arm. Additionally, he is implied to rival SSJ2 Kid Gohan, and would've put up better resistance against the latter's full power Kamehameha if he wasn't caught off guard.

No argument with that.

It can be argued that Goku wasn't actually present during the beam struggle, but was merely giving mental support like in Gohan's final beam struggle with Cell.

That's debatale but its more likely that Goku was there given that he was shown to be there with his children unlike against Cell that was telephatic.

When did I say that the gap between Gohan & Broly is huge because of Broly's tanking feat? You're just needlessly and inaccurately overcomplicating things.

That was a mistake.