Recent Chapter Discussion

[ahill1]

Sabo ain’t dead. Morgan’s always publishes the truth which is why CP0 tried to kill him to cover up what happened. My guess is that there was an assignation/attempt and they’re trying to pin it on Sabo which is why Ivankov and Dragon were freaking out when they read the news.

I dunno. It sounded to me like Morgans was trying to publish fake news and was then confronted by a Government guy that wanted a certain news to be published -- not necessarily something that covers up the true nature of the news.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

I dunno. It sounded to me like Morgans was trying to publish fake news and was then confronted by a Government guy that wanted a certain news to be published -- not necessarily something that covers up the true nature of the news.

Doubtful, considering how prevalent the idea of the World Government pushing the truth under the rug for their own gain (eg. Void Century, Will of D, The inside of Mariejois, etc.) has been throughout the story's narrative.

 

[ahill1]

I dunno. It sounded to me like Morgans was trying to publish fake news and was then confronted by a Government guy that wanted a certain news to be published -- not necessarily something that covers up the true nature of the news.

Doubtful, considering how prevalent the idea of the World Government pushing the truth under the rug for their own gain (eg. Void Century, Will of D, The inside of Mariejois, etc.) has been throughout the story's narrative.

Didn't you say up above that the publication of Sabo's death would work for the Government's benefit?

 

[Captain Cadaver]

Indeed, hence why the covering up of the truth that's been a running theme for the WG seems so likely.

 

[ahill1]

Indeed, hence why the covering up of the truth that's been a running theme for the WG seems so likely.

How would they affect the Revolutionaries if they covered it up though?

 

[Captain Cadaver]

The lie of Sabo having been killed would be a crushing blow to the Revolutionaries, knowing that their second-in-command had been killed long before any kind of turning point in their campaign could be made.

 

[ahill1]

The lie of Sabo having been killed would be a crushing blow to the Revolutionaries, knowing that their second-in-command had been killed long before any kind of turning point in their campaign could be made.

Yeah, but what I'm asking is how such news would have gotten to them and therein affected them if Morgans covered the truth via the Government's act? Wouldn't that go against the plan you suppose they enacted?

 

[Captain Cadaver]

Yeah, but what I'm asking is how such news would have gotten to them and therein affected them if Morgans covered the truth via the Government's act? Wouldn't that go against the plan you suppose they enacted?

Not necessarily. Firstly, we'd need confirmation of how great a scope and influences Morgans has that would allow him to spread the truth faster than the WG could spread their cover story. Secondly, Morgans rebellion may very well have been part of the government's plan, given how sending a CP0 member that was easily disposed of is far from foolproof when coupled with how the government hates constant snags in their plans.

 

[ahill1]

Not necessarily. Firstly, we'd need confirmation of how great a scope and influences Morgans has that would allow him to spread the truth faster than the WG could spread their cover story

He's apparently influent enough that they sent an agent to make sure he'd publish the story they wanted. Why do this if they can simply overwhelm Morgans' news with their influence?

Secondly, Morgans rebellion may very well have been part of the government's plan, given how sending a CP0 member that was easily disposed of is far from foolproof when coupled with how the government hates constant snags in their plans.

Well, in that case, sending that agent would be meaningless. The same occurrences would have undergone without the need for that agent appearing.

Plus, like I said, didn't you theorize that the WG might be wanting to destabilize the Revolutionaries with a fake news? How is covering up an apparent influential news a smart move?

Furthermore, this wanting to shaken up the Revolutionaries with a fake news... wouldn't them promptly find Sabo if he weren't dead? For them to hop on such a plan, they should at least know Sabo is out of the picture for the time being.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

He's apparently influent enough that they sent an agent to make sure he'd publish the story they wanted. Why do this if they can simply overwhelm Morgans' news with their influence?

That is a fair point. I would say that even if overwhelming his scope, it would still be inevitable that his news would spread and cause confusion in either case.

Plus, like I said, didn't you theorize that the WG might be wanting to destabilize the Revolutionaries with a fake news? How is covering up an apparent influential news a smart move?

Furthermore, this wanting to shaken up the Revolutionaries with a fake news... wouldn't them promptly find Sabo if he weren't dead? For them to hop on such a plan, they should at least know Sabo is out of the picture for the time being.

Whatever has happened to Sabo will be far less severe than either sources are saying, given Oda never tries to kill off characters unless to evoke emotion.

---

New chapter was a decent reveal of past events, though not much many couldn't have already pieced together and the idea of Gap and Roger having teamed up in the past does seem like a bit too much of wish-fulfilment. Also doesn't help that the segment of Sengoku stating the Yonko and Roger's bounties comes off as very immersion breaking when it was a highly unnecessary act that's only there for the fans obsessed with bounty levels.

Still far better than any other Wano Arc chapter though. I wouldn't be surprised if that apparent rumour of a previously unknown threat becoming the endgame of OP turns out to be Rocks, since his inclusion in the story would otherwise be unnecessary padding if Oda plans to do nothing with him or his past.

 

[ahill1]

That is a fair point. I would say that even if overwhelming his scope, it would still be inevitable that his news would spread and cause confusion in either case.

How that scene comes off to me is Morgans trying to publish a fake act to attract more attention worldwide, being then confronted by a WG agent that wanted a certain news to be published (Sabo's death)... It's clear by the dialogue that up to the point of receiving the call from Wapol he wasn't aware of the news they wanted to be published. He got a call from Wapol and was seemingly surprised with the content of it (which is, imo, the reveal of Sabo's incident). Being then a news that would fulfill his purpose in even larger scales, he published it.


Have yet to read the new chapter. Only caught a glimpse of the bounties, that had already been picked up by the spoilers. It's funny seeing the big names in OP reaching 4-5 billions when some years back people were theorizing Roger to have 1.5 billions or so. Big Mom's strongest crew member amounted to around 1 billion, so her bounty reaching 4x such amount sure adds in showing the difference between the Yonko captains and the strongest commanders.

WB's bounty is fairly close to Kaido... Is that supposed to be WB at his prime or did they diminish his bounty once he got older? Because it seems even old WB was > Kaido (as he was referred to more than once as the strongest man alive), so I'd think a young/prime one should have more of a spacing over him.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

WB's bounty is fairly close to Kaido... Is that supposed to be WB at his prime or did they diminish his bounty once he got older? Because it seems even old WB was > Kaido (as he was referred to more than once as the strongest man alive), so I'd think a young/prime one should have more of a spacing over him.

I wouldn't say their bounties are "fairly close". Perhaps in a percentage sense, but a 435 million difference is absolutely staggering. Putting that in perspective, that's only a slightly lower gap in bounties than between the best of East Blue's pirates and someone who can take down one of the strongest Shichibukai (Luffy) or the hypothetical bounty of a God complex Logia with great Kenbunshoku Haki who is known to destroy islands (Enel).

Even if viewing it as close when considering the vast jump in bounties for Yonko tier, it is important to remember that Kaido is a lot more active in picking fights with people than WB is and is renowned for being seemingly invulnerable. Whitebeard may have been stronger, sure, but even in his prime he wasn't unmatched and, therefore, not often the Marines' main threat.

I don't see why they'd lower his bounty with age. Even an old WB had the world government mobilising all their forces together due to the sheer threat he posed and what he lacks in his old strength, he makes up for with knowledge that could be detrimental to the government (seemingly knowing about the Will of D. and One Piece's existence from his encounters with Roger).

 

[ahill1]

I wouldn't say their bounties are "fairly close". Perhaps in a percentage sense, but a 435 million difference is absolutely staggering. Putting that in perspective, that's only a slightly lower gap in bounties than between the best of East Blue's pirates and someone who can take down one of the strongest Shichibukai (Luffy) or the hypothetical bounty of a God complex Logia with great Kenbunshoku Haki who is known to destroy islands (Enel).

Well, I'd say that viewing the bounties proximity through a percentage analysis would be more consistent with what we are shown. For instance, Kaido's is 300 millions bigger than Big Mom's (300 millions being also a pretty considerable amount for a bounty), while one couldn't easily take out the other, to the point they seemed evenly matched after a while the fight had began. If we want to view the Yonkos as relatively close, then analysis them through addition would let Shanks, for instance, in a position he could do nothing to Kaido... Yet that also seems unlikely with him having stopped Kaido from pursuing WB.

Even if viewing it as close when considering the vast jump in bounties for Yonko tier, it is important to remember that Kaido is a lot more active in picking fights with people than WB is and is renowned for being seemingly invulnerable. Whitebeard may have been stronger, sure, but even in his prime he wasn't unmatched and, therefore, not often the Marines' main threat.

That's a fair point, although it's worth noting that Kaido has lost quite a few times and like you said, WB seemed more up to par with the world's biggest secrets.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

Well, I'd say that viewing the bounties proximity through a percentage analysis would be more consistent with what we are shown. For instance, Kaido's is 300 millions bigger than Big Mom's (300 millions being also a pretty considerable amount for a bounty), while one couldn't easily take out the other, to the point they seemed evenly matched after a while the fight had began. If we want to view the Yonkos as relatively close, then analysis them through addition would let Shanks, for instance, in a position he could do nothing to Kaido... Yet that also seems unlikely with him having stopped Kaido from pursuing WB.

Bounties aren't a measurement for just power though, so using the Yonko's bounties as some kind of power ranking system for them when everything in the story has shown them as equals would be pointless. Shanks is the lowest out of the 3 living "originals" as his crew seem to be far less active in terms of conquests and have seemingly no ties to the criminal underworld. That's a whole lot less in terms of global danger than two individuals who's pockets are dug deep into that trade.

That's a fair point, although it's worth noting that Kaido has lost quite a few times and like you said, WB seemed more up to par with the world's biggest secrets.

Still, being seemingly uninjured in spite of everything is an inconceivable threat to the world government when in the body of someone with strength close to Whitebeard, albeit inferior, and in far better health than the latter eventually became. Also, Whitebeard never seemed to actively conquer nations and instead gave them his protection, unlike Kaido who fully invades and asserts his dominance. Add all that up, and it's reasonable to see why the gap between them is relatively small.

 

[ahill1]

Fair points, only that as far as I recall, the WG hasn't openly shown this big of a concern on the whole black market trade and business and has treated things related to the will of D and discovering of the lost century as bigger priorities in being eradicated, being then questionable that they'd elevate Kaido's bounty on such a tangent, but not WB's with his closer relationship with Roger, understanding of the OP and possibly other things that could turn the World upside down.

Holding the strongest title means that such person would defeat any foe in a 1 vs 1 match in all likelihood, to me. It'd seem far-fetched to own such title but still lose to someone who isn't "stronger in physical strength" but can outlast him with stamina. In this case, such person with such powerful stamina and "intangibility" should claim the title of strongest. Strongest imo encompasses all attributes that leads to a most sure win when fighting 1 vs 1.

 

[Captain Cadaver]

Fair points, only that as far as I recall, the WG hasn't openly shown this big of a concern on the whole black market trade and business and has treated things related to the will of D and discovering of the lost century as bigger priorities in being eradicated, being then questionable that they'd elevate Kaido's bounty on such a tangent, but not WB's with his closer relationship with Roger, understanding of the OP and possibly other things that could turn the World upside down.

Whilst the criminal underworld wasn't a major concern for the WG at first, it would be unavoidable after information of Smiles leaked from Dressrosa due to the potential for strengthening pirate crews (particularly Kaido's).
Whitebeard may have had more knowledge, though he presented himself as not willing to utilise all his abilities unless personally provoked like at Marineford (eg. never journeying to Raftel).

Beyond that, from an in-universe perspective, the gaps between bounties and their actual amount don't even matter, really. It's not as though the Marines expect anyone (save from perhaps the combined effort of top tier Marines like Garp and the Admirals) to be capable of taking down even one of the Yonko and cash in on them, so whatever figure is given ends up being pointless when getting to such levels of power.

 

[ahill1]

Whilst the criminal underworld wasn't a major concern for the WG at first, it would be unavoidable after information of Smiles leaked from Dressrosa due to the potential for strengthening pirate crews (particularly Kaido's).
Whitebeard may have had more knowledge, though he presented himself as not willing to utilise all his abilities unless personally provoked like at Marineford (eg. never journeying to Raftel).

Beyond that, from an in-universe perspective, the gaps between bounties and their actual amount don't even matter, really. It's not as though the Marines expect anyone (save from perhaps the combined effort of top tier Marines like Garp and the Admirals) to be capable of taking down even one of the Yonko and cash in on them, so whatever figure is given ends up being pointless when getting to such levels of power.

So they would have increased Kaido's bounty after more intel on such business with the smiles? If so, it wouldn't be by that much considering Big Mom's bounty is still fairly close to his one and it wouldn't sit right for her to have the bigger bounty with him being described as the strongest creature post WB, plus his crew members not being implied to be any weaker than Big Mom's.

Well, it's not like it matters that much. I'd agree that as long as one's bounty is some amount above the other's, it's a fair game. But I'd still have preferred that the bounty gap between Whitebeard and Kaido could better represent a solid gap that prime WB should have over him ,as even after losing a considerable amount of force he is still regarded as the strongest.

Iirc someone from the WG addressed the bounty "system" and stated they are analysed upon and asigned a value depending on the threat level a certain pirate or criminal represents to the WG. It seems there's some level of thought put on the amount and the spacing, I'd say.

 

[SSJ2]

Starting part 3 of Wano. I swear man this arc had better improve.

 

[SSJ2]

Lmfao Morgans stomping the CP agent.

I’m only on page 8 of 956, but there is already far too much mystery. These 8 pages could have been shortened to 2 or 3.

 

[SSJ2]

Sabo is dead again? I’ll believe it when I see it.