SSG3 Trunks vs. 50% FPSS Goku

[ahill1]

Even if we were to take that seriously, burst SSJ2 Goku was enough for Vegeta to know that he was outlcassed badly, implying that Goku wasn't far from his max prior to transforming.

Goku doesn't has to be at full power of SSJ for transform into SSJ2. Against Bootenks Goku was able to transform instantly in SSJ3.

Where did I say he was?

If SSJ forms use multipliers, then his SSJ2 was multiplied by whatever SSJ power he was just using.

Goku could have powered up in his SSJ state before he went to his SSJ2... doesn't affect much what I said.

 

[Kyo]

Yep, he stopped powering up, but he hadn't powered down. You're looking at a bona-fide, genuine 50% Goku right there, and he has no aura.

Goku's warm up power is whatever. I personally go with 50%. You can go with whatever. I'm just shutting down the aura argument.

 

[SSJ2]

Goku doesn't has to be at full power of SSJ for transform into SSJ2. Against Bootenks Goku was able to transform instantly in SSJ3.

Where did I say he was?

If SSJ forms use multipliers, then his SSJ2 was multiplied by whatever SSJ power he was just using.

Goku could have powered up in his SSJ state before he went to his SSJ2... doesn't affect much what I said.

I don't see that personally, but to each their own.

 

[ahill1]

Where did I say he was?

If SSJ forms use multipliers, then his SSJ2 was multiplied by whatever SSJ power he was just using.

Goku could have powered up in his SSJ state before he went to his SSJ2... doesn't affect much what I said.

I don't see that personally, but to each their own.

It's showed two pictures of Goku SSJ before he went SSJ2...He could had powered up in this time before he went SSJ2.

 

[SSJ2]

Yeah, but that is conjecture. We have nobody stating that he made a power up before transforming.

 

[ahill1]

Yep, he stopped powering up, but he hadn't powered down. You're looking at a bona-fide, genuine 50% Goku right there, and he has no aura.

Goku's warm up power is whatever. I personally go with 50%. You can go with whatever. I'm just shutting down the aura argument.

Do you think Goku [Warm up] being Goku [rest state] makes sense ?

 

[Kyo]

No. Goku [rest state] is a very small power. It's the power that Goku uses when he's eating dinner with his family and stuff like that. An everyday, ordinary level.

Goku [Warm up] can be 30% or 20% or whatever you want, just keep in mind that this isn't the same as Goku [rest state].

 

[ahill1]

Yeah, but that is conjecture. We have nobody stating that he made a power up before transforming.

I don't think it conjecture. The gap between SSJ Goku [Full power] and SSJ Goku [suppressed] is too big, since : Goku SSJ [Full power] >>> Dabra >>> Goku SSJ [suppressed]; this gap is sure bigger than Goku SSJ2 [Full power] and Goku SSJ2 [burst], so it's logical assume that Goku SSJ powered up.

 

[ahill1]

No. Goku [rest state] is a very small power. It's the power that Goku uses when he's eating dinner with his family and stuff like that. An everyday, ordinary level.

Goku [Warm up] can be 30% or 20% or whatever you want, just keep in mind that this isn't the same as Goku [rest state].

So Ducas stating that Goku ( movie 8 ) was in his rest state was wrong ? lol.

 

[Kyo]

I think so I thought he said it was 50% Goku though. I don't know, it's been a while since I've read that huge post of his.

 

[ahill1]

I think so I thought he said it was 50% Goku though. I don't know, it's been a while since I've read that huge post of his.

In his thread, Ducas said that Goku [Movie 8] was his normal state as SSJ, and this Goku SSJ [Normal state] had the same power as Cell [Warm up], therefore much stronger than Vegeta SSJG2. But I found this a bit odd for the reasons alredy stated by Ace Att.

There's nothing wrong with Goku [Warm up vs Cell] being weaker than his 50%, right ?

 

[Kyo]

I would say no, nothing wrong with it. I sometimes even sway towards that side sometimes.

 

[ahill1]

I would say no, nothing wrong with it. I sometimes even sway towards that side sometimes.

I go with Goku [50%] > Trunks SSJG3 because Victorious and Kenshi had good points about it.

Only two questions :

1 - Vegeta is surprised when Goku said that he cannot beat Cell... does it implies that Vegeta knew Goku was stronger than him ?

2 - If Goku SSJ [Warm up] is >> Goku SSJ [normal state] why he had no aura ? You said that normal state + 1 = aura, and yet he has no signs of a power up.

 

[Kyo]

1 - I don't think so. I think he was more surprised at Goku's lack of confidence, or something of the sort.

2 - I was being sarcastic. Normal + 1 isn't aura. That was just the aura that comes when people power-up in SSJ.

 

[p123]

Yep, Resting Goku = Warm Up Goku.

 

[ahill1]

Yep, Resting Goku = Warm Up Goku.

Do you think this ? lol, Kyouks just refute this.

Besides this why Vegeta did not feel surpassed by Goku SSJ [normal state] if this Goku was equal to the Cell which effortlessly kicked Vegeta's ass ?

 

[ahill1]

1 - I don't think so. I think he was more surprised at Goku's lack of confidence, or something of the sort.

2 - I was being sarcastic. Normal + 1 isn't aura. That was just the aura that comes when people power-up in SSJ.

1 - Why Vegeta would be surprised with Goku's lack of confidence if he tought Goku was weaker than him ? Vegeta would not be surprised by Goku's lack of confidence in this case.

2 - I know, but even so why Goku had no aura if Goku [Warm up] >>> Goku [normal state] ? He should have done a power up for this to be true.

 

[Kyo]

1- I'm not really sure why. It could be that he considered the possibility of Goku being weaker than him, but was in denial and didn't want to believe that it was possible at the same time. It could also be that he took Goku's incredibly calm nature to mean that Goku would be confident no matter what.

Either way, as far as Vegeta's thoughts on Goku's power go, I think there are two options:
a) He thought for sure Goku would be weaker than him
b) Part of him considered the possibility that Goku was stronger, while part of him denied it, hence why he was still shocked and crushed at 50% Goku's display

2- He did do a power-up. He had to have done one no matter what, imo, whether you think Warm up = 50% or 10%. I mean, it's not like he's gonna go to sleep at the power he plans on using to fight Cell. We just didn't see it, kinda like 50% Freeza on Namek. I think he can bypass the lengthy power-up, like he did in the Boo arc when he instantly turned SSJ3, he just took a long time the first time for show.

 

[Zippy]

Yep, Resting Goku = Warm Up Goku.

Resting goku ~ warm up goku goes against all logic.
- Goku comes out of the ROSAT, Vegeta does not claim to be weaker than goku. until he displays 50%
- According to the rest goku ~ warm up goku logic this is the same goku that fought warm up cell who was way above ssjg2 vegeta. (who again, did not claim inferioty to rest goku)

 

[Pakl]

Resting goku and warm up Goku are the same... they are natural... Goku just powered up for Korrin... At the very least 50% MSSjin Goku >> warm up Goku

Vegeta says he is superior so he must have thought Goku 50% was his max... I already countered those arguents, Kyo you are presistent