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Chapter: 325 (DBZ 131), P8.2-5 Context: after Goku and full-power Freeza have fought for a while Goku: “I quit. [ ] As a backlash from you using your 100% power, you’ve passed your peak, and your ki is steadily dropping…I’m starting to think that there’s no point in fighting any more than this…”...

Yeah, but that was a drained and severly wounded Freeza... I've always thought that they can use ssj transformation power without actually transforming, it would make sense taking into consideration some cases, plus, the ssj power is inside them. Do you think that could be the case?

Well, this theory makes sense to an extent, but still isn't clear to me, are you saying that Goku before transforming into ssj against Freeza got 5x stronger? I don't know how that could make sense, especially when Goku was clearly out of energy after using Kaioken x20, but still... Doesn't...

What makes you think that?

Considering cases such as Piccolo vs 20 or Gohan vs Buutenks makes me wonder.

Like when he said that his calculations are worst than he thought? Like when he make it seems that even base Vegeta is above Piccolo, but then think that his energy could be useful against ssj Vegeta? Yeah, he is a lord of the inconsistency. When he realizes how things truly are, he ran and get...

So Gohan can be at 60 million even though he can't transform into ssj? lol

And Gero was proven wrong time by time... If he was still below Piccolo at full power after absorbing energy from a suppressed Piccolo, what difference can it make absorbing energy from humans, Piccolo and Gohan against a far stronger Vegeta?

What makes you think that?

I highly doubt that the humans have PL above even 1st form Freeza. lol

Yeah, that was the scene I was referring to. And I think it makes sense, but it seems that he was holding his arm, it squeezed it and then the barrier dissapeared.

What do you think?

Zamasu survived the Final Kamehameha, but he at least needed to regenerate from the last blow from ssjb Vegetto, so I think, Vegetto was stronger.

I don't care about you or whatever you think either... Plus, being hostile with a girl just ruin your image and you don't seem to realize it (or if you do, you won't accept it)

The message wasn't even directed at you...

Zamasu got weaker & slower, he was keeping up & doing well against ssjb Vegetto at the beginning of the fight, but then he can't keep up with his speed anymore, after that, he was fighting evenly with Trunks and forced him to leave his body... Vegetto did most of the job while Trunks only...

Freeza stomps. lol

Freeza have many tricks upon his sleeve, so I see him winning this one. Lol

Hit was in pretty good shape, unlike when he fought Goku in the Champa tournament, plus, Vados states that Hit was fighting more like an martial artist against goku rather than an assassin. Personally, I don´t take that as evidence considering that Freeza was equal, if not weaker than base Goku...

Well, Hit came out unscatched after receiving a kamehameha from ssjb Goku whereas Goku was in base... Hit was indeed stronger than ssjb Goku, but not by a far margin. lol