Kid Buu vs Super Buu

[Southern Gothic]

t0sh do u let other ppl have their opinions or do u only want to prove others wrong???

srsly it's kind-of pathetic, u trying so hard.

We can respectfully disagree. However, I have to have the last word.

If you are only posting to have the last word then you don't need to be posting at all.

 

[kriss-]

t0sh do u let other ppl have their opinions or do u only want to prove others wrong???

srsly it's kind-of pathetic, u trying so hard.

We can respectfully disagree. However, I have to have the last word.

If you are only posting to have the last word then you don't need to be posting at all.

Nah.

I pointed out a valid argument as stated above.

 

[Fantastische Hure]

t0sh do u let other ppl have their opinions or do u only want to prove others wrong???

srsly it's kind-of pathetic, u trying so hard.

We can respectfully disagree. However, I have to have the last word. Besides, I picked out a flaw in their logic, yet again. ^.^

no u can't jst have the last word

that's not the way it works

u might shut-up & let ppl go-on with their lives, instead of wasting their time trying to "convince/debate" u

 

[kriss-]

Eraser Gun.
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[Southern Gothic]

Just leave it be and stay on topic, everyone.

 

[kriss-]

It's not spam, please don't edit out the relevancy of logic and posts. I'll exclude the term 'moderator' but there is no reason to try and erase everything else.

He argued that time was the reason Goku couldn't train to get stronger. I countered by stating that Beerus hadn't decide to destroy the Earth just yet. So time is not a factor and therefore not a valid argument. Summarily, Goku found that he couldn't get stronger and the only way to actually increase in strength was the merge with Vegeta -hence the black and white statement. It's not grey, it can't be twisted, it's essentially as straightforward as it could get.

 

[Pyro]

What, so Goku assumes Beerus isn't going to destroy the Earth, so he has whatever time he needs to train? It doesn't sound like Goku to assume that if there's a viable threat to his planet.

 

[kriss-]

There is nothing contradicting it and Beerus already promised not to destroy Earth -as long as nothing pisses him off. So no, the logic doesn't hold.

It also causes a contradiction as opposed to being a solution. Goku tries to train to get stronger. If time were a factor -he would be an idiot to endure training knowing he doesn't have the time, then it would defeat the purpose of the two scenarios (BoG & Db Super) where we see Goku enduring training. Conclusively he determines he cannot get stronger by training and the only alternative is to merge with Vegeta.

 

[Southern Gothic]

It's not spam, please don't edit out the relevancy of logic and posts. I'll exclude the term 'moderator' but there is no reason to try and erase everything else.

He argued that time was the reason Goku couldn't train to get stronger. I countered by stating that Beerus hadn't decide to destroy the Earth just yet. So time is not a factor and therefore not a valid argument. Summarily, Goku found that he couldn't get stronger and the only way to actually increase in strength was the merge with Vegeta -hence the black and white statement. It's not grey, it can't be twisted, it's essentially as straightforward as it could get.

Now we all know for sure how you feel about Goku and his time on Kaio's Planet. So I will let your rewrite stand, but there should be no further reason to repeat this again.

 

[Six Trails]

Goku tries to train to get stronger.

Let's go by this logic then. Beers easily defeats Goku, and then Goku attempts to train. If Goku had little to no gains over the 4-5 year gap between Boo and BoG, why would he initially be confident in his ability to train and catch up to Beers? If anything, that would imply he had great gains over the 4-5 years if he thinks he can train to catch up to Beers at first.

 

[kriss-]

Goku tries to train to get stronger.

Let's go by this logic then. Beers easily defeats Goku, and then Goku attempts to train. If Goku had little to no gains over the 4-5 year gap between Boo and BoG, why would he initially be confident in his ability to train and catch up to Beers? If anything, that would imply he had great gains over the 4-5 years if he thinks he can train to catch up to Beers at first.

Instead of finding a solution, you are attempting to cause contradictions. Anyways, see my post above, it sums it up nicely.

Time is not relevant at this point. Exclude that from here on in.

I would have to ask you why Goku tried to get stronger by training alone -in Battle of Gods & Dragonball Super, only to determine and state that he couldn't get stronger.

Explain.

 

[Six Trails]

I would have to ask you why Goku tried to get stronger by training alone -in Battle of Gods & Dragonball Super, only to determine and state that he couldn't get stronger.

Explain.

That's my point exactly. If he had no gains from Boo to BoG, why would he even try training at first? He should've automatically knew he wouldn't get stronger.

 

[kriss-]

I would have to ask you why Goku tried to get stronger by training alone -in Battle of Gods & Dragonball Super, only to determine and state that he couldn't get stronger.

Explain.

That's my point exactly. If he had no gains from Boo to BoG, why would he even try training at first? He should've automatically knew he wouldn't get stronger.

So why did Goku attempt training and state he couldn't get stronger BY training?

 

[Six Trails]

I would have to ask you why Goku tried to get stronger by training alone -in Battle of Gods & Dragonball Super, only to determine and state that he couldn't get stronger.

Explain.

That's my point exactly. If he had no gains from Boo to BoG, why would he even try training at first? He should've automatically knew he wouldn't get stronger.

So why did Goku attempt training and state he couldn't get stronger BY training?

You're avoiding the question now. Just because he can't get stronger during Super, that doesn't mean it applies to the previous 5 years. So, if you're done avoiding my question:

If Goku had no gains over the last 5 years, why would he think training would be effective first?

 

[Pyro]

Because he's a true idiot. At least, that's what I've gathered from the revelations about his actions Boo Saga onwards.

 

[kriss-]

That's my point exactly. If he had no gains from Boo to BoG, why would he even try training at first? He should've automatically knew he wouldn't get stronger.

So why did Goku attempt training and state he couldn't get stronger BY training?

You're avoiding the question now. Just because he can't get stronger during Super, that doesn't mean it applies to the previous 5 years. So, if you're done avoiding my question:

If Goku had no gains over the last 5 years, why would he think training would be effective first?

There is nothing suggesting that it doesn't apply to the previous 5 years. Anytime significant gains are made it's always established as to what degree and why.

Summarily, Goku was looking for a way to get stronger, and only determined that the only possible solution was to merge with Vegeta. Training was useless at that point. Nothing infers it wasn't useless prior to that point either.

Also, writing is bad sometimes and it doesn't always make sense. Toriyama clearly doesn't care about consistency so why would he here.

 

[kriss-]

Because he's a true idiot. At least, that's what I've gathered from the revelations about his actions Boo Saga onwards.

Since when has Goku been anything but a true idiot?

 

[Six Trails]

There is nothing suggesting that it doesn't apply to the previous 5 years.

Nice strawman. You haven't provided anything saying it does apply to the previous 5 years, so you instead just say nothing suggests it doesn't apply. The burden of proof rests on you. Prove it does apply to the previous 5 years, otherwise your argument is based off conjecture.

Anytime significant gains are made it's always established as to what degree and why.

That's arbitrary.

Summarily, Goku was looking for a way to get stronger, and only determined that the only possible solution was to merge with Vegeta. Training was useless at that point. Nothing infers it wasn't useless prior to that point either.

How is this any different from what you said above?

Also, writing is bad sometimes and it doesn't always make sense. Toriyama clearly doesn't care about consistency so why would he here.

Failing to see how this is relevant to the current discussion.

 

[Fantastische Hure]

any1 else feel like they're wasting time trying to convince/debate t0sh???

wot if u gais waste years doing that???

i'm telling u not worth it

 

[kriss-]

There is nothing suggesting that it doesn't apply to the previous 5 years.

Nice strawman. You haven't provided anything saying it does apply to the previous 5 years, so you instead just say nothing suggests it doesn't apply. The burden of proof rests on you. Prove it does apply to the previous 5 years, otherwise your argument is based off conjecture.

Anytime significant gains are made it's always established as to what degree and why.

That's arbitrary.

Summarily, Goku was looking for a way to get stronger, and only determined that the only possible solution was to merge with Vegeta. Training was useless at that point. Nothing infers it wasn't useless prior to that point either.

How is this any different from what you said above?

Also, writing is bad sometimes and it doesn't always make sense. Toriyama clearly doesn't care about consistency so why would he here.

Failing to see how this is relevant to the current discussion.

Answer the 'burden of proof argument':

Toriyama
~ for presenting a crisis for the main characters, who had grown so strong they reached a point where there was nothing higher.

Source: http://www.kanzenshuu.com/2013/05/20/akira-toriyama-directly-comments-on-dragon-ball-evolution/

So no, Goku and no character made any gains during the 5 years gap. Hence why Goku blatantly states he couldn't get stronger by training. He's just working out to keep what he has.