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Vados' statement would mean that SSJ Kefla was stronger than suppressed Jiren.

It's very strange. I might have to go with: SSJ Kefla (potential full strength) > SSB Goku/Vegeta (ToP) > Gohan (ToP) = SSJ Kefla, Berserk Kale (peak) >>>>>> Berserk Kale (weakened vs Pride Troopers), SSJ Caulifla (peak) >>>>>> SSJ Caulifla (wrecked vs Golden Freeza) So in the manga...

This reminds me of that debate over Gohan's ToP strength compared to Blue Goku. Good times.

I thought you were against Blue (Moro) > Jiren?

Ha. Moro got a bigger boost from eating weakass Seven-Three than fusion.

So SSBE or UI Gogeta wouldn't be able to hit Seven-Three Moro whatsoever?

Which is very odd because Moro basically absorbed Seven-Three yet Vegeta couldn't do jackshit against him, when we know Vegeta could split Piccolo if he wanted to.

I think Kefla was stronger than Blue Goku in the tournament. :/

Couldn't it be that Moro was explaining because he didn't think the Z gang realized Seven-Three was copying everything?

You're way too late. Beckett got this covered decades ago.

I don't think so. Gogeta was certainly a lot stronger and wasn't using 100% effort, but he was definitely putting in a good amount to get Broly down. Broly was just too strong to stay down even after multiple zesty attacks.

Your levels don't reflect that. That's not really how it works. You don't make unnecessary changes just for the sake of doing it. The story governs the strength boosts. If the story doesn't imply they got stronger, you're literally making up a part of the story that doesn't exist just because...

Right, so why is Cell so close to Piccolo? He took the attack with no damage. That's a huge gap in strength. OK, so you're agreeing with me that they're pretty irrelevant. That's why I'm asking why you're making them stronger with no directive from the story to do so. That isn't addressing the...

Stronger than Freeza at the very least. Doubtful about Cell or Boo.

Piccolo only started getting tired moments before Cell showed up. It still doesn't excuse Android 17 from not even attempting to block the attack and instead running away from the area. 17 doesn't lose stamina so if he wanted to get away from it, that means it's incredibly strong. But why make...

So god ki. Still not a godly aura, whatever that means.

This doesn't make sense. Kai doesn't apply to the manga. In the manga, Vegeta was barely 30,000. Android 20 implies he's stronger than 19, and Daizenshuu 7 confirms this. Vegeta and Trunks heavily imply Cell is stronger than the Super Saiyans but still weaker than the androids. Cell tanked...

Jaco and Gohan never fought the same person while looking similar in strength.

That's not implied, though. In the flashback, South Kaioshin isn't some ant compared to Dai Kaioshin.

Damn, then South Kaioshin is a fucking beast since he's even more powerful than Dai Kaioshin.